Freaking out about about setting out

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pastrywhiz

Hi there, Ive been a member for some time and done the short course thing, but Im finding it hardto absorb the setting out aspect of the job, knowing where to lay the first tile is so important that I dont want to approach a project until Im sure I have this skill in place, do you guys have any foolproof methods you might share with me, this would be very helpfull to me. Many Thanks.
 
Hello Pastry, first measure where your centre lines are, ping a chalk line out.Then lay tiles out dry from boxes..in line incl grout lines.When you are happy that your lines of grout are not giving you bad ( small ,tricky)cut then proceed.....Gaz
 
take your time and take everything into account.

Maybe make yourself a check list to include windows, sink, bath and doors etc etc to ensure you have included everyhting.

Half the room width and height and you should be ok. Remember width ways each wall can be done in its own right.

When looking at height just use your check list!

It will become 2nd nature, just take your time as its ie if not the most important thing. If you dont lay a tile on day 1 till 10-10:30 thats fine in my book!
 
im fairly new to tiling, did a course last may then did my bathroom, thought i did a good job untill i got experience, the settin out on my bathroom was bad, quater tiles or less at every corner. I always use a batten then draw the tiles including my spacers then mark the centre of the wall and work out where my tiles will lay. its easy to see where you are rounf plugs and windows etc.


I was really slow at first, sometimes it took me a few hours of head scratching but like holohana sai it does become second nature. Ive done about 12 jobs now and ill say im about 80% - 90% up to the speed i want to be so it does take time.
 
Establish a horizontal level line all the way around the room which corresponds to a grout joint.

Before any tiles are set, it's crucial to determine the correct tile layout. A good starting point is to establish a horizontal line all the way around the bathroom at a height which will correspond to a grout joint. Most professional tilers will put this line a little under half height of the wall, above bath height, sink and toilet (so as to avoid having the sanitary ware breaking up this horizontal line, which is a key reference point as tiling is in progress).
Determining the best height requires some judgement as every room is different. But here's some pointers as to how you might go about it:
Measure half vertical height on a stretch of wall uninterupted by sanitaryware and try that as a grout line, measuring tiles to the floor or ceiling. If that height leaves less than half a tile at the top and bottom, move the line by half a tile up or down. Now test out this height around the bath and window. Does it leave any small strips around the bath or just below the window or just above? If so, adjust accordingly to erradicate the strips ie if you've an one inch strip above the bath, move the line down an inch. If you've a one inch strip below the window sill, move everything up an inch.
Once you are happy you've found the right height, draw this line all the way around the room. Now double check that you won't be left with narrow strips at the floor, or ceiling, or bath or window edges. Sometimes it's impossible to avoid a strip somewhere and it just comes down to judgement as to what will work best. Generally though, a strip at the floor will be less noticeable than one at the ceiling or window.
Establish a vertical guide line on each wall corresponding to a grout joint.

Again find the mid-point along the horizontal distance of the wall and determine how many tiles will fit either side and whether a strip will be left at the wall. If there's less than half a tile at the wall edge, move the vertical line (either direction, it doesn't matter) by half a tile. Rarely should you start tiling from one wall, unless you're very confident that the wall is vertical from top to bottom, and that you'll be left with a good size cut at the other side. By instead finding the mid point, you'll achieve a more balanced look with equal cuts on each side.
Tile the bottom half of the bathroom below the horizontal level line all the way round.

Choose an appropriate trowel for the size of tile being used. If you're unsure see these tiling tools. Rubi Tile Cutters, Scaffolding Tools, Tape Measures & Measuring Tools UK Spread the selected adhesive over an area which can be comfortably tiled within about 10 minutes (the adhesive will start to skin over once spread so you can't afford to leave it to long before placing the tile).
Place the first tile just below the horizontal reference line you've established, and to the side of the vertical line you've drawn. Work down and to the side untill you've filled that section of the wall. Modern adesives have fairly high grab so you should find that although the tiles slip down a litte initially, they should firm up within minutes and then stop moving allowing you to work down to the floor and put in the lowest tile.
There are factors which affect the grab of the adhesive. Primarily being 1) How absorbent the background surface is (less absorbent surfaces such as tile on tile, or gloss paint will slip more than an more absobent surface like plaster, or plaster board, or tile backing board. 2) How much adhesive is used. If excessive adhesive is used (say to make up for an imperfection in the wall) then more slip will occur. Caution is required if you need to build out a wall excessively since adhesives have a recommend maximum depth which should not be exceeded.
If you find you get excessive slippage on the tiles then you may need to fix a batten to support the tiles as you go.
Use tile spacing pegs to maintain even spacing between the tiles and keep the grout joints fairly clean of adhesive. It's much easier to clean them with cardboard and a sponge whilst the adhesive is wet than once it has dried.
Use your spirit level to check that you achieve a good horizontal line to the top of this section and a good vertical line to the side. If that's done and the spacing between tiles is maintained properly, then that should be fine.
Tile the top half of the bathroom.

Once the bottom half of the bathroom has been tiled, then generally the top half is fairly straightforward. You've now got the bottom half tiles giving you the horizontal line all the way round. Just tile small areas at a time, working outwards from a vertical line running up the full height of the wall, and upwards from the below tiles. Use spacing pegs to maintain even spacing and check horizontal and verticals regularly with a spirit level.
 
Great advice from DH as per usual.

Can I suggest that some "hands-on" experience with a more experienced tiler might be really useful for you also though?
Sometimes we need practical experience when starting out.
I s'pose we are all still learning! I'm sure someone on here can offer you hands-on advice???

Mark
 
do you still have notes from your course?if so get them out and have a read.Alternatively do as DH says
 
Hello Pastry, first measure where your centre lines are, ping a chalk line out.Then lay tiles out dry from boxes..in line incl grout lines.When you are happy that your lines of grout are not giving you bad ( small ,tricky)cut then proceed.....Gaz

Sorry Gaz,
what's all this nonsense about Dry Laying -
Not necessary and not good practice
Sorry mate :huh2: :mad2:
----
think it is also crucial to find the highest point of the ceiling and lowest point of the floor when doing a full tile.
Some ceilings and floors can run out from anything between 20mm and 60mm ( have seen more )
This can be critical when ascertaining where to set your tiles.
Have seen far too many jobs where this has not been checked and the tiler has ended up with increasing gaps filled filled with grout at celing height because the ceiling runs off. Or same at floor level
 
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Many thanks to you all with regards to my query,I feel a bit more positive to setting out than before, but will do some more practice before letting myself loose on the public, receiving prompt and informative answers from people you dont even know!!! just says how valueable this forum is to all alike. Once again many thanks
 
I have always found that some guys find it harder than others to work the cuts out even when they have been tiling for a while and some can do it straight away and some it suddenly just clicks i think its like reading a map some are better than others and some just panic : Pete
 
DHCeramics, I did read a post in another thread by NETT Darren some weeks ago that was a similar or the same and regarding tiling down from mid reference line. In 3rd paragraph you say to tile downwards of the horizontal reference line you've established. Can you tell me what the purpose is of you guys using this method?
Thanx
 
DH is as usual bang on with his approach to setting out yet ultimatley we all seem to find our own method and with time modify it until it suits us.

Personally when it come to bathrooms I start with a full tile around the bath (bath being level that is) and as it is usual for a border to be included i measure up to the underside or above the border and draw a datum. I then measure from this border to all obstacles, floor, ceiling, window, door and so on. Any small cuts are then done away with by lowering the datum only (as if you raise it it will then give small cuts around the bath) when I am satisfied that I have no longer any small cuts I re draw the datum and re check.

Vertically I either start with a grout line or full tile in the centre of the window depending on the window width and measure out around the room working out finishing cuts in the corners. The point that the measurements meet should be at the corner of the room that has the shortest distance horizontally that way the flow of the tile is not as noticable (ie between door frame and ceiling). Again any small cuts are done away with by moving this start point in the relevant direction and re checking.

Experience goes along way if you remember and note your mistakes as you go along. On one occasion I forgot to include the border when setting out started with a full tile above the bath and only when I got to the window did I find what should have been a 35mm grout line below the top edge ended up being a 15mm grout line above it. Also remember walls do run out so what could be a trim of 10mm of a tile at waist height ends up being a 10mm gap at the ceiling if the wall runs out 20mm.

:thumbsup:
 

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