outside corner in rectangle bathroom

[mr angry]

hi guys,

please excuse my terminology if i dont describe my current diy job. i have just ordered tools from amazon... cube laser, trowel, float, grout etc... i have not ordered the leveling tile kit yet as there are so many to choose from so hopefully someone can recommend a cheap good kit.

anyways, i am about to start tiling my bathroom but im not sure how to tackle the outside corner inside the bathroom. my choice is the offset method rather than the stacking one. maybe you can convince me otherwise :/

i would also add that i cannot get the rest of the pant off the wall as its stuck pretty good. ive read on google that all paint should be removed or by doing heavy scores in the plaster to make the adhesive bond. what do you recommend for heavy scoring the walls as i feel using a razor blade is not suffice.

i also have to tile the floor and upon checking this it looks like a 9m ply was used for the tiles already laid. should i use the same thickness of ply when i do the floor? if so, then i will be left with a step up into bathroom like before (not a big problem) around an inch height. i need to rip it all up anyways due to radiator pipe work and water inlet for toilet being offset.

the measurements for wall width 22cm for left width and 45cm for the right width. the tiles for the wall are 298mm x 498mm bought from b&q. if you need any more info please tell me.

should i start tiling the walls first or the floor?



thanks

cameron

 

[Time's Ran Out]

DIY requires a certain amount of knowledge and general practicality.
If you use the search feature of the forum you should find everything discussed from the last 12 years.

 

[mr angry]

hi,

ive tried searching and i cant find anything that relates to my query....am i using the wrong terminology? ive tried googling it and cant find anything either

cheers

 

[ttt tiling]

I agree with John , you're basically asking too much. Research the basics , then ask specific questions.
We can't turn you into a seasoned pro overnight.

 

[mr angry]

ok so how do i tackle the outside corner when tiling round onto the flat? do i have a full tile cut all the way down both sides or have mini cuts with an offset look?

 

[Old Mod]

If you want an off set look, find centre of both walls and draw a plum line top to bottom on each.
Whether you choose to start full piece or cut piece on the first row is entirely your choice.
For us we would see how that relates to the whole room rather than focusing on that one small area.
So follow the bond around the room see if it presents complications elsewhere.
This is the look you will try to achieve.
Every other course will look like one tile wraps around the corner.

 

[ttt tiling]

I would recommend stacked anyway.
Looks more contemporary and infinately easier.

 

[mr angry]

after much consideration i will stack the tiles, not my preferred choice but should alleviate much headache. it will look nice but not as nice as i can visualise

as for my outside corner (left & right)im assuming that i will just use cuts to stack/lay up the wall and then work from the middle main wall in the photo.

also, when i attempt the floor is it ok or pleasant to the eye to have the offset look against a stacked wall tile?

just need to get a baton and plywood from b&q and its hammer time

cheers

 

[mr angry]

is there a good tool for scribing the wall?

 

[Qwerty]

Scrape off all the paint with a 4" scraper

 

[mr angry]

i have a scraper of all different sizes but this paint is for not coming off properly. some areas like you see in photo were ok....peeling off but others i would need to hammer and chisel it.

 

[Qwerty]

Spread ready mixed tile adhesive on it, leave for 30 mins then scrape it off

 

[Bill]

Good luck with stacking those B&Q tiles with inline joints as they will be sizey as hell.

 

[ttt tiling]

Tiling ain't easy or they'd all do it!

 

[mr angry]

hi when i tackle the floor will it be ok to use a 9mm marine ply with a 6mm cement backerboard? or just use a thicker marine ply?

cheers

 

[mr angry]

anyone?

 

[Qwerty]

What is your floor now, floorboards?

 

[mr angry]

yes just floorboards. ive ripped up the 18mm plywood, not sure if its marine ply :/

can i get a 12mm marine ply and put a 6mm backerboard on top? do i need to use some sort of adhesive with the backboard if i do need it?

cheers

 

[Qwerty]

I personally would remove all floorboards and lay minimum 18mm WBP ply and then overboard that. Dont mess about with thin ply, it doesnt comply with British Standards and it will fail

 

[mr angry]

do the floorboards not run underneath the walls and would it be more difficult to remove them? if i dont choose to remove the floorboards what would you recommend using on top of them?

cheers

 

[Qwerty]

You will have to check if they do, but even if they are I will nearly always remove them. You can overboard onto the floorboards but you will probably find there are holes everywhere for pipes etc and boards are poorly fixed or warped. I perform full refits so I take up the flooring 90% of the time to amend plumbing

 

[mr angry]

here are some photos of floor and piping for radiator. how far down should i cut the pipe in order to put a bend on it? is my diagram ok for what i plan to do? my terminology is crap so please tell me exactly what parts i need. you will see from photo diagram of how my radiator is and the other diagram of my proposed look when ive sorted the pipework.

can i use plastic pipe on copper or just copper? is there a preference. i realise this is a tiling forum so im assuming some you you professionals tackle this type of thing everyday....maybe im wrong :/

should i replace the floorboards with a thicker plywood? my intentions were to keep the floorboard as it is 22mm thick and seems in a reasonable condition. my issue is what thickness should i replace the floor with and how thick a backer board should i use on top? is this the recommended way forward? can i use a thicker than 22mm plywood??

thanks in advance

cammy

 

[Qwerty]

I would suggest you visit our sister forum- www.ukplumbersforums.co.uk

From your photos though I would seriously check out the structural integrity of the joists. I can see alot or rot and cut away areas of joists

 

[Qwerty]

Your diagram looks fine to me though

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

ive tried to join the plumbers forum with no success.... if someone could alert the plumbersforum because ive tried everything! deleted cache, hostory blah blah blah1

i have used chrome, safari and firefox and i cant get the captcha thing to work. i even tried refreshing and still nothing...any ideas???

cheers

 

[mr angry]

here is where my drain valve is in my dinning room

also, since i cant join the plumbers forum just now can someone advise on the best way forward for the u bend from bath? can i have the wast from bath go straight down and underneath floor boards with the u bend going straight into the pipe? or do i need to have the ubend above the floor line meaning i have a s shape trap as shown in photo with the waste going straight down adding into the pipework below floorboards. is there any pros/cons of having it above or below?

cheers

 

[mr angry]

i would also add regarding my copper pipe to query in the diagram above....is plastic pipe ok to join onto copper using pushfit if i have a combi boiler setup?

cheers

 

[Qwerty]

i would also add regarding my copper pipe to query in the diagram above....is plastic pipe ok to join onto copper using pushfit if i have a combi boiler setup?

cheers

Yes

 

[WetSaw]

here is where my drain valve is in my dinning room

also, since i cant join the plumbers forum just now can someone advise on the best way forward for the u bend from bath? can i have the wast from bath go straight down and underneath floor boards with the u bend going straight into the pipe? or do i need to have the ubend above the floor line meaning i have a s shape trap as shown in photo with the waste going straight down adding into the pipework below floorboards. is there any pros/cons of having it above or below?

cheers

View attachment 99538 View attachment 99539

If there's too much fall before the trap it can end up being syphoned out , also it's obviously better if you have access to the trap for cleaning.

 

[mr angry]

If there's too much fall before the trap it can end up being syphoned out , also it's obviously better if you have access to the trap for cleaning.

please define how much the fall is? what is the tolerance before a syphoning effect happens? i reckon the distance from the bath to the connecting pipes below floorboards would be about 1 to 1 half ft max.

cheers

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

is this acceptable for scoring walls or do i need to heavily score it more?

thanks

 

[Qwerty]

You need to remove all that paint

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

what type of screws do i need for overboarding? i have a 22mm thick floorboard and 18mm wbp plywood going on top. the room is about 9ft x 5ft does anyone have a rough guess how many screws i need?

the walls are stripped back to plaster, do i need to prep the walls, floorboards or the ply before i start screwing it down?

to get the paint off the walls i just used an electric planer and it came off in seconds....very dusty though lol

here is an update on walls and pipework so far...



cheers

 

[jimthetiler]

On masonry walls I use a welders chipping tool,it looks like a small pick axe and makes short work of chopping into walls to create a mechanical fixing for tiles.Holes are space at about 50mm apart.First tile walls but leave out bottom cuts as you will tile the floor next and then bottom wall cuts last.
In my area I offer diyers an hour of tuition for £25 maybe there is a tiler here who can get you started.

 

[jimthetiler]

hardy backer is probably the best material to replace ply.

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

my reactangular bathroom is not equal at the short sides ie window side and opposite door side. it is about 2-3cm out at the window side compared to the door side. i suppose what im trying to say is that it tapers outwards towards the window side if that makes sense. how do i tackle this before i start tiling?

if i leave it as i will know doubt have issues with squaring this off when i do the floor. any ideas on how to remedy this situation is most helpful

cheers

 

[mr angry]

update on floor...it looks like i have a slight dip in the middle of floor after i have screwed the plywood down...

should i use a self leveling compound? i would say the dip is about 3mm when i use my level across the floor. is there a tolerance for dips or will the tiling adhesive make up the shortfall?

cheers

 

[Qwerty]

You're outside of the tolerance of levels there if its across the length of a level. I would recommend self levelling compound to sort it. How big is the dip?

 

[mr angry]

the dip is about 3mm but the floor is solid should i still use self leveling compound?

any ideas how i can make an access hatch with tiles on top or if i can buy one complete to tile upon?

cheers

 

[mr angry]

hi,

i am about to put batons up on the wall but i need some urgent help!

i measured the walls from top to bottom and they are all different. here is a photo of measurements in cm. how do i tackle walls which are different sizes in height?

 

[Dumbo]

Set your battens at a height you have enough to cut off at the ceiling as well as the floor but also take I to consideration things like window head , window sill , door head , bath or shower tray or both and any other horizontal surface that is going to be in place before tiling.

 

[mr angry]

do i tile straight onto the walls with the adhesive or do i need to prep it first with a treatment? ive already started so will these tiles fall off in a few weeks because i didnt treat them?

i assumed when i removed all the paint i was good to go without doing anything else to the walls :/

please tell me its going to be ok!

 

[Perry]

You should never score the plaster it makes it weaker.

 

[mr angry]

what about the walls though....do i need to treat them or will i be safe to continue to tile over the current state?

 

[Spare Tool]

Should have been primed really..what adhesive are you using?

 

[mr angry]

im using mapei ultimate super grip ready mix.

 

[Spare Tool]

im using mapei ultimate super grip ready mix.

Oh is it self priming, is that recommended for 300x500 tiles?

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Ceramics up to 30x30cm!

 

[Spare Tool]

Maybe @jimthetiler £25 an hour might have been money well spent

 

[Time's Ran Out]

 

[mr angry]

it says on a sticker that it can be used on tiles 300x600 its as if it was an update on the adhesive without changing the actual bucket info. this was bought from b&q and i can provide the sticker on lid if you require.

going back to my initial problem what issues might i come across?

 

[Qwerty]

Any chance of a photo of said sticker please. I'm interested in what @Mapei UK Marketing would say about it.

The risk is that the adhesive wont set therefore little bond to the wall. Did you say your tiles were ceramic or porcelain?

 

[Spare Tool]

it says on a sticker that it can be used on tiles 300x600 its as if it was an update on the adhesive without changing the actual bucket info. this was bought from b&q and i can provide the sticker on lid if you require.

going back to my initial problem what issues might i come across?

I would suggest cutting your loses now and remove the tiles before they fall off and injure someone...bucket adhesive on dusty un-primed walls is never going to end well.

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

unfortunately for me ive already started with the tiling and to remove them now would send my wife into a fit. mainly due to me taking so long and also doing all the work myself

if i continue as is what should i look out for if these decide to come loose? are there any given signs beforehand or is it a case of smash, bang, whallop at anytime. is there a test i can do to see if they are solid enough or stuck properly?

its the b&q tiles travertine ones (are they classed as stone?) and the ridged. this is what the staff member recommended when i was buying the stuff. i take it im using the wrong stuff for these type of tiles?

here are some photos of where im at

 

[Flintstone]

They are either porcelain or ceramic tiles, and that adhesive is not suitable for porcelain and it will never set, in my opinion it’s not suitable even if there ceramic tiles. Why did you just jump into this without first finding out at least the correct methods and materials?

 

[WetSaw]

Try pulling a tile or two off the wall, you'll soon know whether they're stuck or not.

 

[mr angry]

the guy at b&q recommended mapei ready mix and nobody mentioned anything about using a different adhesive for a certain tile. i did mention 2 weeks ago that i was putting batons up but i didnt think to mention or nobody said what type of adhesive are you using until i asked here about treating the walls and thats when andystiletelling asked about the adhesive.

how much force do i use if im to try and pull a tile off? ive done about 2/3 of the bathroom and the wall you see is the only one left. so is my diy job a lost cause? what do i do to try and salvage this?

will the adhesive take time to settle? do i leave it as is? will i start to notice tiles coming loose after several weeks? what are the given signs?

worried to say the least

cheers

 

[Spare Tool]

You've been given bad advise at B&Q, a cement based mix with water should have been used...however it does state on the sticker it is suitable and I would also like to hear Mapies take on this. Its the dusty unprimed walls that are the biggest concern imo, does it not mention the need for priming on the bucket? Imagine making dumplings and you sprinkle flour to stop the dumplings from sticking to the chopping board, same issue with your walls in a roundabout way. Try a scrapper under a corner of one of the first tiles you fixed, if that just pops straight off then your in trouble...if it takes some force then you might be ok. If you think they're stuck ok and you want to risk leaving them up then leave them at least two weeks before grouting and give the adhesive half a chance to go off, and prime whatevers left before sticking any more tiles on..

 

[mr angry]

ive tried the scraper on a corner of tile and it seems ok, didnt see any movement but thats because the ones i tested (bath/shower area) has been set for about 2 weeks, these feel solid. i dont want to tap with a rubber mallet incase i break the seal behind tile....or should i? i understand what you are saying about the dust example. i did brush the walls down before hand but i guess maybe that wasnt enough for my job at hand, lesson learned there! hopefully all is well....fingers crossed lol

this might be a daft question but to help further issues down the line, is it possible to add a small depth of silicone into the spacing of tiles and then grout over the top, or is this a NO NO? my reasoning behind this is to stop further water getting behind tiles.

i have read that grout lets in water over time and this will no doubt weaken my setup if it somehow penetrates the walls or adhesive. i am using a 5mm spacer but looks bigger because of the chamfered edges of these tiles so it looks like a 6/7mm gap :/


cheers

 

[Spare Tool]

No you can't silicone then grout over the top. Just take your time with the grouting and make sure there's no pinholes or missed bits of grout. Spray the grout after its properly dry with LTP grout and tile protector, really helps to make the grout more water resistant..

 

[mr angry]

thanks andy how often do you use the ltp grout and tile protector?

cheers

 

[mr angry]

after checking a few tiles at the window area i had a few loose tiles which i took off to investigate. the window wall seems to have been made up of plasterboard and then a skim of brown plaster on top with a plastic wire mesh stuff inside it, downwards from window area, which is different from the side walls where this is made up of about an inch of white plaster, not sure if there is any mesh inside it but in comparison seems a lot thicker and better stability that the brown plaster on the window wall.

from where the tiles were loose there seems to be no mesh in this area towards the ceiling and side areas of window. when i pulled a few tiles off, the thin layer of brown plaster came away with the adhesive and was very weak however the rest of the wall seems intact and ok. im assuming that when this was done the need for this wire mesh was missed out left and right side of the window.

also, im not going to use the mapei super grip on last wall. so what stuff should i buy going forward from b&q or screwfix or anything else to help finish this job

thanks for your time guys

 

[mr angry]

is there a particular brand of primer for the last wall i need to finish from b&q, screwfix or somewhere else?

i have seen a few different ones....everbuild sbr bond, bal bond sbr, bal primer, bal prime apd..... which one is specific to my cause? i did read the prime apd which states for dusty tiling substrates, should i buy this one?

please help!

cheers

 

[Spare Tool]

You should really use the same manufacturers primer as your chosen adhesive and I don't buy from B&Q so don't know what they stock, have you not got a tile giant or Topps or even a local independent tile shop you can buy from instead? Where ever you get it from you'll need a mix with water bagged slowset adhesive..

 

[mr angry]

can anyone tell me if i can use bal white star plus ready mix adhesive and is it better than the mapei super grip? someone local is selling 7 tubs of it for £50 so was wondering if this would kill 2 birds if i dont need to prime the walls or would i still need to prime the walls if i purchased the bal stuff or not bother and buy the powder slow set stuff.

i also have an option with weber set rapid spf 20kg bags x 5 for £50 if thats better i can get that.

cheers

 

[mr angry]

im getting the weber set rapid 3 bags for £20 hopefully this is ok.

 

[Boggs]

That will be fine but is going to go off pretty quick.
A standard setting adhesive may be better if your not that quick tiling.
We use Tilemaster standard setaflex on walls, gives a few hours working time, but it’s used up before it goes off anyway.

 

[WetSaw]

You still need to get primer on the wall.

 

[Waluigi]

@Boggs - is that the red bag you’re using?

 

[Boggs]

Yeah, the maroon bag.

 

[Waluigi]

I wanted to try that but nobody stocks it near me.

 

[mr angry]

i will mix a small amount each time before i tile due to me being a novice. what primer should i get...the weber pr360 or something else?

cheers

 

[WetSaw]

i will mix a small amount each time before i tile due to me being a novice. what primer should i get...the weber pr360 or something else?

cheers

PR 360 will be fine.

 

[Waluigi]

Don’t forget to clean your bucket and tools between mixes otherwise the next mix will set much quicker than it should.

So much easier with a slow setting adhesive. I suppose at least you got a good deal though.......

 

[Boggs]

I wanted to try that but nobody stocks it near me.

I buy direct from Tilemaster but you have to have it by the pallet.
I have used many adhesives in the past but find this one of the nicest to use and is the best blend of price/performance.
I use their Ultimate adhesive on floors, but you have to be really clean as you go, it’s sticks to everything and is a pain to get off when set!

 

[mr angry]

@Waluigi

it was either the weber or the 7 tubs of bal white star plus. i was sure that the majority of folk here wouldve picked the 3 bags of weber stuff at £20.

i cant find a local supplier of the weber 360 but i can get the bal primer 1kg for £9.99 out of topps tiles is this ok to mix with weber?

 

[Boggs]

@Waluigi

it was either the weber or the 7 tubs of bal white star plus. i was sure that the majority of folk here wouldve picked the 3 bags of weber stuff at £20.

i cant find a local supplier of the weber 360 but i can get the bal primer 1kg for £9.99 out of topps tiles is this ok to mix with weber?

That will do the job just fine.

 

[mr angry]

i cant get to topps right now but can goto b&q later. can i use the mapei plaster primer £9 b&q?

cheers

 

[Boggs]

i cant get to topps right now but can goto b&q later. can i use the mapei plaster primer £9 b&q?

cheers

Yep.
Whatever you use the result will be better than the other 3 walls with nothing on and pre mixed addy.

 

[mr angry]

thanks guys

 

[Spare Tool]

I buy direct from Tilemaster but you have to have it by the pallet.
I have used many adhesives in the past but find this one of the nicest to use and is the best blend of price/performance.
I use their Ultimate adhesive on floors, but you have to be really clean as you go, it’s sticks to everything and is a pain to get off when set!

How'd you get an account with TM..like rocking horse sh#t?

 

[mr angry]

I ended up buying the unibond plaster primer from b&q as they didn't have any Mapei stuff in stock even though it showed 5 on their computers. Seems to be less dusty when wiping a finger down the wall so hopefully everything is all good

Can I use the remainder of this Weber rapid set stuff as a self leveler on the floor and is it flexible enough to use when I start the floor tiles?

Cheers

 

[WetSaw]

I really hope it's not just PVA..

 

[mr angry]

It doesn't say pva anywhere on it and that it's for gypsum or plaster for tiling and for use with cement adhesive.

It was £12 for the unibond 2kg.

I hope I've not effed up here :/

 

[mr angry]

ive made an error of judgment when i started tiling the last wall as when ive lined up my bead to coving it looks like its going to stick out roughly about 1cm. it looks like i used too much adhesive and packed it out to much when tiling upwards due to the walls being off. the downside is that its gradually moving outwards and looks to be about a 1cm out past the bottom of the coving leaving a big lip.

i suppose i could remove the coving and re-do it with a slightly bigger replacement but are there other ways to blend this in without removal?

cheers

 

[Martyn Leeds]

[QUOTE="

i suppose i could remove the coving and re-do it with a slightly bigger replacement but are there other ways to blend this in without removal?

cheers[/QUOTE]

No,
if its proud, then its proud.
You can polish a turd, but at the end of the day, its still a turd.

 

[mr angry]

So the answer is leave it and it can't be fixed? Surely replacing a slightly bigger coving will remedy the situation :/

Hasn't any non professional diyers had this issue in tiling before? Or has it always ended up perfect at coving?

 

[Boggs]

Can you post a picture?

 

[Martyn Leeds]

Sure you could put bigger coving on, but you asked for ways to blend it in without changing the coving.

Pics needed

 

[Waluigi]

Remove coving. Cut a strip of 12.5mm SE plasterboard. Bond to the wall with drywall adhesive. Attach new coving. All materials are inexpensive.

Use different thickness plasterboard to suite your exact requirement. 9.5mm and 15mm board is readily available.

Not much you can do with it if you want to leave the coving on. Either finish the tile short of the coving or put a trim on the top of the tile. Or both.

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

when you say trim on top of tile, what do you mean? is this a separate trim from the coving and what does it look like? where can i buy this trim from?



cheers

 

[mr angry]

it looks like my floor has a slope of 1" from door to window. not sure how i missed that but im guessing its because i didnt use a batten at the time with my level :/

anyways can i use cement or mortar to bring the level up and screed the floor? im not sure how much stuff i will need but can i mix sand and cement as a base before i start tiling the floor?

please recommend what type of stuff to buy before i buy the wrong stuff

ive not had much time to do the bathroom lately so its just when i have time thats why it seems to be taking forever!

cheers

 

[mr angry]

Anyone?

 

[Qwerty]

Just use self levelling compound

 

[acaciaguy]

SLC all the way. Get it level and make your life easier for fixing tiles

 

[mr angry]

hi guys,

been busy lately so the bathroom was put on back burner. i have since finished the tiling but i still have the issue with the coving at top. in a previous post someone mentioned a trim on the coving. can someone describe what this is?

i know someone also mentioned about using new coving over old coving....will i have any trouble keeping the old coving in place? the coving already installed, measures at 110mm, what size do you recommend to cover old coving?

here are some photos of the tiling so far... and yes, the tiles still need cleaning up lol. also the tiles you see at left hand side which look off, is an actual access point/hatch and i need to cut a hole for the drainage too

thanks in advance!

 

[mr angry]

anyone?

 

[J Sid]

I'd remove old coving and tile a bit higher then have new coving fixed over tile and to cover damage ceiling from removal of old coving.

 

[Dan]

Don't mind me while I bump up some older but good threads. If you can contribute to the thread, go ahead. But if it's nothing for you then don't reply and it'll soon drop off the What's New page etc.
Worth linking to our new forum structure while I'm doing stuff:-

• USA Tile Forum for DIY and Professional Tile Fixers
• UK Tiling Forum for UK tiling advice
• Canada Tile Forum
• Tiling Advice Australia
• Ireland Tiling Forum
• Tiling Tools
• DIY Tiling
• Tiling Courses
• Tile Import / Export