rules of setting out - TilersForums.com

[ross lewiss]

hi
iam just trying to see if the books i have read this week have made any impact on my learning. this is what i have learned can you tell me if i am on the right path.

1. datum line should be set up around the room as a reference to find the ceiling heights and the floor depths.
2. british standards say cuts should be half a tile minimum where possible.
3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre
4. same applies for walls
5. always make a gauging staff to see where the tiles will fall.
6. try and aim for what looks right in the most obvious parts of a room.
7.full tile above bath if its possible

i have numbered these points incase there is any that are incorrect so that you can clearly correct me on what no is wrong
also, where should you start with a full tile. is it in the corner of a wall or should there be cuts there because i have centered the wall. if anybody could add setting out tips that would be cool
thanks, ross

 

[macten]

2. B.S state cut tiles will be kept to a minimum and will be as large as possible and in unobtrusive locations. But less than 1/2 is fine.
7. Full tile off bath is advantageous but only if it works for the rest of the room.

Best to center wall like you said - full tile in corners are best avoided due to walls not being plumb.
The only other thing I would add is once you've decided on the best options chuck a few tile lines round the room to work to.

 

[White Room]

Sometimes you have to make a sacrfice but try and make sure it's not in an obvious sight line if you can

 

[mz30]

Hi ross lewis,
I will try and address all your points as best i can

1. datum line should be set up around the room as a reference to find the ceiling heights and the floor depths.

On a site this would be the norm,if i am laying a floor in sand and cement screed the builder is required to provide a datum for finished floor and ceiling heights,on a domestig job you have to do it yourself,
in my experience i would never come off a floor or ceiling as the chnces of them being right are usually slim.

2. british standards say cuts should be half a tile minimum where possible.

That is correct ,but if you are tiling brickbond you will usually have to sacrifice somewhere

3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre

In an ideal world yes,but unfortunately the standard of boarding and plastering does not allow this.

4. same applies for walls

Not sure what you mean here

5. always make a gauging staff to see where the tiles will fall.

Sometimes its a good idea ,but i have only used that on a handful of occasions(big floors)

6. try and aim for what looks right in the most obvious parts of a room.

That's a fair comment.

7.full tile above bath if its possible

I use mostly porcelenosa tiles and 99% of the time set off from the bath or the shower tray,do not rely on this for domestic jobs though.

 

[macten]

3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre In an ideal world yes,but unfortunately the standard of boarding and plastering does not allow this.


Confused by that - all windows have a center. If it's out of shape then just square it off when you tile it.

 

[GatesheadCol]

I think the point he was trying to make about the centering of a window is that sometimes, and especially more so in house which had a xseparate bathroom and toilet and are now one is that if you centre from a window by the time you get to the wall on either side it may not work or the next window for that matter.

Its really a case of each room is gonna be different unless you have a lot of new biulds and the windows are exactly centre and in centering the tile to the window you get a perfect cut tile at each wall.

But lets face it that never happens does it lol.

As for full tiles froim the bath up hmm, how many of yuou have come across plumbers that still put a bath on a slight slope?? you've gotta watch for it, start at one end with a full tile and by the time you get to the end you have a sliver to slot in.

personally I find what looks best from all walls, windows and baths and sinks and take it from there. sometimes these rules just dont cover everything and you have to adjust somewhere.

In most cases though th4e window is a focal point so I start from the center o the window, but whether its a full tile in the centre or a grout line just depends on the room.

Basically treat each and every rom differently

 

[macten]

Aahh - 2 windows on one wall - I get you.
Hate it when plumbers don't put baths in level :mad2:

 

[mz30]

3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre In an ideal world yes,but unfortunately the standard of boarding and plastering does not allow this.


Confused by that - all windows have a center. If it's out of shape then just square it off when you tile it.

Hi macten, my point was not really about whether or not the window has a centre ,my point was with the standard of plastering and boarding on sites(and older homes)centering a window can cause you a multitude of problems ,the first thing i always do is put an edge across the reveals and the cill of any bathroom as that is going to be (always)the most difficult wall.
If you set off from the centre you may end up having to bed all said tiles out to suit,which as you know around a window can be a royal pita.
If i can set a full tile out from one side (as long as its plumb)and have a decent sized cut on the other ,i would rather do that than struggle making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

 

[Gazzer]

Hi macten, my point was not really about whether or not the window has a centre ,my point was with the standard of plastering and boarding on sites(and older homes)centering a window can cause you a multitude of problems ,the first thing i always do is put an edge across the reveals and the cill of any bathroom as that is going to be (always)the most difficult wall.
If you set off from the centre you may end up having to bed all said tiles out to suit,which as you know around a window can be a royal pita.
If i can set a full tile out from one side (as long as its plumb)and have a decent sized cut on the other ,i would rather do that than struggle making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

I know where you are coming from there

 

[macten]

I must have my dumbass head on at the moment. I can't get my head around what you're saying. :whatchutalkingabout

PS I wouldn't tile out from the center of window - just center the window in my setting out

 

[ross lewiss]

thnaks guys, i really appreciate all your help. its difficult when reading a book but its alot less expensive than a tiling course with travel and accomodation. this forum is better than a course and its free so i owe a big debt of gratitude to dan for waking up one morning and deciding to open a forum,,
big thanks to mz30 for the detailed response. it helped put my mind at ease that i am on the right lines ishhh lol
thanks, ross

 

[mz30]

I must have my dumbass head on at the moment. I can't get my head around what you're saying. :whatchutalkingabout

PS I wouldn't tile out from the center of window - just center the window in my setting out

Your losing me now macten,why centre the window if your not going to work from it?
Just for anyones info my last resort is to centre the window

 

[macten]

LOL my head hurts.
I will always center window, looks much nicer - don't know why it would be easier to go full tile one side (apart from having a few less tiles to cut)
OK I center window, plumb a line down from one side of window where my first full tile will be down to my baton and tile from there - working my way across and up till I get to the window.

 

[frogeye]

thnaks guys, i really appreciate all your help. its difficult when reading a book but its alot less expensive than a tiling course with travel and accomodation. this forum is better than a course and its free so i owe a big debt of gratitude to dan for waking up one morning and deciding to open a forum,,
big thanks to mz30 for the detailed response. it helped put my mind at ease that i am on the right lines ishhh lol
thanks, ross

Hi Ross

can I suggest that you take a course?
I did a 4 week course and found it invaluable - okay I don't have the speed or the experience of a time served pro, but I find that most times I have an informed view of most of the questions posed on this site. My course concentrated on the basics and now I know why. Setting out, setting out and setting out - so important.
Yes this is a cracking site - but a few days with a good teacher will more than pay for itself whether you are a diyer ( I still include myself here) or a pro (thats why so many people ask to be taken on for free to gain experience)

frogeye

 

[ross lewiss]

hi
iam just trying to see if the books i have read this week have made any impact on my learning. this is what i have learned can you tell me if i am on the right path.

1. datum line should be set up around the room as a reference to find the ceiling heights and the floor depths.
2. british standards say cuts should be half a tile minimum where possible.
3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre
4. same applies for walls
5. always make a gauging staff to see where the tiles will fall.
6. try and aim for what looks right in the most obvious parts of a room.
7.full tile above bath if its possible

i have numbered these points incase there is any that are incorrect so that you can clearly correct me on what no is wrong
also, where should you start with a full tile. is it in the corner of a wall or should there be cuts there because i have centered the wall. if anybody could add setting out tips that would be cool
thanks, ross

 

[macten]

2. B.S state cut tiles will be kept to a minimum and will be as large as possible and in unobtrusive locations. But less than 1/2 is fine.
7. Full tile off bath is advantageous but only if it works for the rest of the room.

Best to center wall like you said - full tile in corners are best avoided due to walls not being plumb.
The only other thing I would add is once you've decided on the best options chuck a few tile lines round the room to work to.

 

[White Room]

Sometimes you have to make a sacrfice but try and make sure it's not in an obvious sight line if you can

 

[mz30]

Hi ross lewis,
I will try and address all your points as best i can

1. datum line should be set up around the room as a reference to find the ceiling heights and the floor depths.

On a site this would be the norm,if i am laying a floor in sand and cement screed the builder is required to provide a datum for finished floor and ceiling heights,on a domestig job you have to do it yourself,
in my experience i would never come off a floor or ceiling as the chnces of them being right are usually slim.

2. british standards say cuts should be half a tile minimum where possible.

That is correct ,but if you are tiling brickbond you will usually have to sacrifice somewhere

3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre

In an ideal world yes,but unfortunately the standard of boarding and plastering does not allow this.

4. same applies for walls

Not sure what you mean here

5. always make a gauging staff to see where the tiles will fall.

Sometimes its a good idea ,but i have only used that on a handful of occasions(big floors)

6. try and aim for what looks right in the most obvious parts of a room.

That's a fair comment.

7.full tile above bath if its possible

I use mostly porcelenosa tiles and 99% of the time set off from the bath or the shower tray,do not rely on this for domestic jobs though.

 

[macten]

3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre In an ideal world yes,but unfortunately the standard of boarding and plastering does not allow this.


Confused by that - all windows have a center. If it's out of shape then just square it off when you tile it.

 

[GatesheadCol]

I think the point he was trying to make about the centering of a window is that sometimes, and especially more so in house which had a xseparate bathroom and toilet and are now one is that if you centre from a window by the time you get to the wall on either side it may not work or the next window for that matter.

Its really a case of each room is gonna be different unless you have a lot of new biulds and the windows are exactly centre and in centering the tile to the window you get a perfect cut tile at each wall.

But lets face it that never happens does it lol.

As for full tiles froim the bath up hmm, how many of yuou have come across plumbers that still put a bath on a slight slope?? you've gotta watch for it, start at one end with a full tile and by the time you get to the end you have a sliver to slot in.

personally I find what looks best from all walls, windows and baths and sinks and take it from there. sometimes these rules just dont cover everything and you have to adjust somewhere.

In most cases though th4e window is a focal point so I start from the center o the window, but whether its a full tile in the centre or a grout line just depends on the room.

Basically treat each and every rom differently

 

[macten]

Aahh - 2 windows on one wall - I get you.
Hate it when plumbers don't put baths in level :mad2:

 

[mz30]

3. if possible, find the centre of a window and work away from the centre In an ideal world yes,but unfortunately the standard of boarding and plastering does not allow this.


Confused by that - all windows have a center. If it's out of shape then just square it off when you tile it.

Hi macten, my point was not really about whether or not the window has a centre ,my point was with the standard of plastering and boarding on sites(and older homes)centering a window can cause you a multitude of problems ,the first thing i always do is put an edge across the reveals and the cill of any bathroom as that is going to be (always)the most difficult wall.
If you set off from the centre you may end up having to bed all said tiles out to suit,which as you know around a window can be a royal pita.
If i can set a full tile out from one side (as long as its plumb)and have a decent sized cut on the other ,i would rather do that than struggle making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

 

[Gazzer]

Hi macten, my point was not really about whether or not the window has a centre ,my point was with the standard of plastering and boarding on sites(and older homes)centering a window can cause you a multitude of problems ,the first thing i always do is put an edge across the reveals and the cill of any bathroom as that is going to be (always)the most difficult wall.
If you set off from the centre you may end up having to bed all said tiles out to suit,which as you know around a window can be a royal pita.
If i can set a full tile out from one side (as long as its plumb)and have a decent sized cut on the other ,i would rather do that than struggle making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

I know where you are coming from there

 

[macten]

I must have my dumbass head on at the moment. I can't get my head around what you're saying. :whatchutalkingabout

PS I wouldn't tile out from the center of window - just center the window in my setting out

 

[ross lewiss]

thnaks guys, i really appreciate all your help. its difficult when reading a book but its alot less expensive than a tiling course with travel and accomodation. this forum is better than a course and its free so i owe a big debt of gratitude to dan for waking up one morning and deciding to open a forum,,
big thanks to mz30 for the detailed response. it helped put my mind at ease that i am on the right lines ishhh lol
thanks, ross

 

[mz30]

I must have my dumbass head on at the moment. I can't get my head around what you're saying. :whatchutalkingabout

PS I wouldn't tile out from the center of window - just center the window in my setting out

Your losing me now macten,why centre the window if your not going to work from it?
Just for anyones info my last resort is to centre the window

 

[macten]

LOL my head hurts.
I will always center window, looks much nicer - don't know why it would be easier to go full tile one side (apart from having a few less tiles to cut)
OK I center window, plumb a line down from one side of window where my first full tile will be down to my baton and tile from there - working my way across and up till I get to the window.

 

[frogeye]

thnaks guys, i really appreciate all your help. its difficult when reading a book but its alot less expensive than a tiling course with travel and accomodation. this forum is better than a course and its free so i owe a big debt of gratitude to dan for waking up one morning and deciding to open a forum,,
big thanks to mz30 for the detailed response. it helped put my mind at ease that i am on the right lines ishhh lol
thanks, ross

Hi Ross

can I suggest that you take a course?
I did a 4 week course and found it invaluable - okay I don't have the speed or the experience of a time served pro, but I find that most times I have an informed view of most of the questions posed on this site. My course concentrated on the basics and now I know why. Setting out, setting out and setting out - so important.
Yes this is a cracking site - but a few days with a good teacher will more than pay for itself whether you are a diyer ( I still include myself here) or a pro (thats why so many people ask to be taken on for free to gain experience)

frogeye