UK Tiling Forum; Established 2006
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get more than that house bashing...
S
steve187
You get what you pay for!!
your so right , client,s are more bothered about prices than workman ship in most cases
P
Perry
some people are just trying pay their mortgage i reckon get anything in their bank shouldent think no one wants to work for that little
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S
simonb43
Prices are constantly going down all over the country, and its been like that for the last few years now and i don't think it will get much better this year. I believe that the tiling industry is becoming more saturated with new guys off courses, which i really don't mind, but it is dragging prices down. Have recently tiled floor with 600mm x 600mm porcelain for less than £20m2 including materials. Had to do it, bills need paying, don't get paid with me sitting at home
O
ozboz
Hiya, its not only lads on courses mate, its also non nationals plus plumbers electricians , plasteres , joiners and the like, the trade is not properly protected it appears to be easy money so thell have a go, my oldest brother lives in kent, i he a plumber, and not very good at it, so now hes a tiler! While the kent tilers sit at home,def not right
Checkout how Rich handles builders: Amey Tiling Continue to Grow – Tilers in Lymington | Tile News
A good way to go about it. Tell them why you're not going to do the work for them at that rate, they'll eventually realise they can't keep paying peanuts as the work is never grade-A.
Wouldn't work with them all, but if we all did it, a lot would eventually swap over to using elite time-served highly skilled tilers, and they'd let them use the good products they want to.
A good way to go about it. Tell them why you're not going to do the work for them at that rate, they'll eventually realise they can't keep paying peanuts as the work is never grade-A.
Wouldn't work with them all, but if we all did it, a lot would eventually swap over to using elite time-served highly skilled tilers, and they'd let them use the good products they want to.
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Ian
Then the homeowner turns up on here saying they've been ripped off, and the job needs ripping out an re-doing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
P
Peter
No sympathy for people who take the cheapest price and get a bad job. In saying that though, I do understand that if you're not getting much work and someone offers you £50-60 a day for a few days work, it's better than lying in bed making nothing. Just over a year ago, I worked a few weeks labouring at £40 a day after tax because I wasn't getting any other work and had a mortgage to pay. If I just sat in the house and cried about the price then I'd be in arrears now. Some people have to dance with the devil to make ends meet from time to time.
M
MTiler
I originally learnt to tile through a course and I dont charge peanuts!
I
Ian
Ditto Miss T
H
hillhead
The rates are low over here anyway but I haven't had to drop yet.
I'm booking in lots of work at the minute too, too much.
I'm booking in lots of work at the minute too, too much.
T
Thespanishtiler
I feel that in the domestic market it is still possible to command very good rates if your reputation demands it.
the top end of the market is possibly better than 2 years ago.
working with private clients involves a lot of skill that has nothing to do with tiling etc, and also a lot of time and effort on an evening and weekend
contract tiling where you give a m2 price, if you get the job just rock up, tile then go home may pay less but no real hassle.
in the good times the contract tilers on site earned good money and wouldn't have dreamed of going domestic with all the extra hassels.
I feel you have to decide where you want to be in the market and set your stall out to be there.
if you don't like the prices you can get or other people will work for then concentrate on building/moving your business into another part of the market that is more profitable.
in short I don't care what price builders or contractors will pay as I won't work for them.
the top end of the market is possibly better than 2 years ago.
working with private clients involves a lot of skill that has nothing to do with tiling etc, and also a lot of time and effort on an evening and weekend
contract tiling where you give a m2 price, if you get the job just rock up, tile then go home may pay less but no real hassle.
in the good times the contract tilers on site earned good money and wouldn't have dreamed of going domestic with all the extra hassels.
I feel you have to decide where you want to be in the market and set your stall out to be there.
if you don't like the prices you can get or other people will work for then concentrate on building/moving your business into another part of the market that is more profitable.
in short I don't care what price builders or contractors will pay as I won't work for them.
R
rooders
They prob go in low just to get their feet in the door then bump it up as it goes on. i think also households just don't know a thing about tiling. So i guess its therefore impossible for them to realize the standard of work they should expect regarding products/labour until its too late!! They could go and inspect the work everynight during the job, and still would not know shoddy workmanship even though its staring at them. just like me when i get the van fixed!:lol:
S
Stewart
I couldn't have put it better myself Spanish and I'm in total agreement.......!
G
Gall.B
Do agree with Spanish to an extent but as mentioned by others the guys on site, do have there share of hassles and put in the hours, they dont deserve the lack of protection, being tossed to the side for cheap immigrant labour or course guys willing to work for less.
This all started back in 2005 and still nothing has been done to help fellow tradesmen, have seen large scale jobs where I was presented with four new starts where told they where all Tilers, came back to check on the a couple of hours later to check the 3000m2 flor they where starting disaster! expansions left out straight as Colin & Justin blah blah blah. Sat the boys down we had in the ranks a Chef, ex footballer etc all fresh from a six week course. called the CM whats going on? Oh they are cheaper just keep em right!
Its not as easy as all that for EVERYBODY to get in to the highend domestic market when they are not in a fancy part of the country, and the papers are full of adverts like full bathroom head to toe 2k by some Jack of all trades ltd and anyway why should they!
This all started back in 2005 and still nothing has been done to help fellow tradesmen, have seen large scale jobs where I was presented with four new starts where told they where all Tilers, came back to check on the a couple of hours later to check the 3000m2 flor they where starting disaster! expansions left out straight as Colin & Justin blah blah blah. Sat the boys down we had in the ranks a Chef, ex footballer etc all fresh from a six week course. called the CM whats going on? Oh they are cheaper just keep em right!
Its not as easy as all that for EVERYBODY to get in to the highend domestic market when they are not in a fancy part of the country, and the papers are full of adverts like full bathroom head to toe 2k by some Jack of all trades ltd and anyway why should they!
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O
ozboz
To be honest, I am of the opinon that there is an air of arrogance and lack of compassion in what spanish tiler came up with, I personally know a tiler, who's work and ethic to ward this trade is impeccable, he is also well respected and revered on this forum, its a post code lottery, he should be on top money for what ever he does, BUT , due to glut of labour and down turn in work available ,combining what has already been stated on this thread sometimes he is having to cop what ever he can, if you are in an area where rates are still good, well good luck, what comes round goes round, almost 40 years of this trade seen bubbles pop on people a few times
All said here is truth.
Its not down to single thing.
Hard times - people have less money to spend but I still see several refurbishments going on,😛rrr: on most of the streets.
But there isnt enough of rich people to give jobs to all of us.
Our bills must be paid so I rewarded myself paycut but often its not enough to win the job anyway.:incazzato:
Since last Jan 2011 about 50% of my time is no work. (more time for golf - I have really improved- thats the only possitive thing)
I do not want to work for less. Only problem is a lot of people will. :incazzato:What do you do? Go back to working for company and start from scratch on £80-£100+tax a day? :mad2:If you do that confidence is not growing, is it? And contractors will walk on you. And than on top of that u get under preasure from your other half and u see your life going down instead of up.
And u think Flip it! (more likely the other F word)
(and to put cherry on top - do not even dare to think of retirement at old age! What? What pension? - none, work untill u die- hopefuly it will be sooner rather than too late) :lol:
Chin up boys, have a hope and faith. You will get the next job! As long as you have a pair of hands which can do good job you will survive - that your blessing.
Peace
Its not down to single thing.
Hard times - people have less money to spend but I still see several refurbishments going on,😛rrr: on most of the streets.
But there isnt enough of rich people to give jobs to all of us.
Our bills must be paid so I rewarded myself paycut but often its not enough to win the job anyway.:incazzato:
Since last Jan 2011 about 50% of my time is no work. (more time for golf - I have really improved- thats the only possitive thing)
I do not want to work for less. Only problem is a lot of people will. :incazzato:What do you do? Go back to working for company and start from scratch on £80-£100+tax a day? :mad2:If you do that confidence is not growing, is it? And contractors will walk on you. And than on top of that u get under preasure from your other half and u see your life going down instead of up.
And u think Flip it! (more likely the other F word)
(and to put cherry on top - do not even dare to think of retirement at old age! What? What pension? - none, work untill u die- hopefuly it will be sooner rather than too late) :lol:
Chin up boys, have a hope and faith. You will get the next job! As long as you have a pair of hands which can do good job you will survive - that your blessing.
Peace
i use to do loads of domestic tiling ,all high end finish, i moved to the commercial side , because of the lack of work in my area,
pits closing down steel works shutting,
i live in quite a poor area of the country, and prices do reflect that.
how can i compete with a lad who got £56000 redundo from steel works , does a tiling course, and away he goes , charging 8-10 am2 , because in is words i dont need the money , but bored sat at home
pits closing down steel works shutting,
i live in quite a poor area of the country, and prices do reflect that.
how can i compete with a lad who got £56000 redundo from steel works , does a tiling course, and away he goes , charging 8-10 am2 , because in is words i dont need the money , but bored sat at home
D
Deleted member 9966
you can't compete Rob. And that's why other tilers have put their tools away for a while and taken other jobs. Wivers, Brian C and another lad from the NE, Mark I think his name was, all downed tools and went and got jobs doing other things.
S
Stewart
Strange how everyone understands and sympathises when someone post's about how hard it is, how rubbish the prices are and how cheep labour is stopping them getting decent rates and work. Then someone puts balance to the discussion by saying they can still get decent rates and is branded "arrogant and showing a lack of compassion" I find this as another example of how many in the trade struggle to applaud good business sense, acumen and achievement! and to say someone can only command good rates because they live in an affluent area an insult to that tradesman's skills imo! Times are hard out there and there will be winners and losers, but we are all self employed and choose our own work and rates we want to work for. We all run or businesses differently and until the trade becomes licensed and regulated, then there will always be tradesmen being walked on and customers being rip-off by cowboys!
I do agree with Spanish that private domestic tiling requires you to spend a lot of time in evenings (and/or weekends) on site visits, pricing, quoting and invoicing. You still have to invoice on commercial work, but otherwise, it is head down to work hard and fast to make a living - nothing easy about it, but I believe it is a very different market. Overall, I believe that domestic work requires more time and commitment than commercial, but commercial is harder work.
Yet again we are flooding ourselves in remorse because the tiling market is highly competitive at the moment.
I am sorry to those who feel threatened by newly trained tilers, plumbers or plasterers moonlighting, travelling tradesfolk etc. The reality is that this country is in an economic depression. Costs of key living/working needs (fuel, energy, food) keep rising whilst incomes are falling - this affects our customers and other workers as well as affecting tilers. Many people with assorted trade skills are prepared to cross to another trade to make a living - tiling is an easy target if you have some experience in building work. As a full time professional tiler in the face of this competition and who wants to survive in this market you need to find something that gets you noticed and/or offers something unique. Your reputation is critical, and realistic pricing becomes harder when customers feeling the economic pinch want a cheaper service.
To those who worry I say: take another look at JOTY 2011 on this Forum. That quality of tiling is not offered by newbies and moonlighters. You do not have to compromise your integrity, but you may need to compromise your profit to survive. You do have to carefully consider your marketing and and try to target your services at the most suitable customers.
Dan is right - Rich is showing us a way to make a living in a recession.
There is a lot on this forum that should make you realise what is achieveable if you take the time and put your mind to it - we are all having to work harder and smarter for less reward. For the financially better times - you're gonna have to wait.
Yet again we are flooding ourselves in remorse because the tiling market is highly competitive at the moment.
I am sorry to those who feel threatened by newly trained tilers, plumbers or plasterers moonlighting, travelling tradesfolk etc. The reality is that this country is in an economic depression. Costs of key living/working needs (fuel, energy, food) keep rising whilst incomes are falling - this affects our customers and other workers as well as affecting tilers. Many people with assorted trade skills are prepared to cross to another trade to make a living - tiling is an easy target if you have some experience in building work. As a full time professional tiler in the face of this competition and who wants to survive in this market you need to find something that gets you noticed and/or offers something unique. Your reputation is critical, and realistic pricing becomes harder when customers feeling the economic pinch want a cheaper service.
To those who worry I say: take another look at JOTY 2011 on this Forum. That quality of tiling is not offered by newbies and moonlighters. You do not have to compromise your integrity, but you may need to compromise your profit to survive. You do have to carefully consider your marketing and and try to target your services at the most suitable customers.
Dan is right - Rich is showing us a way to make a living in a recession.
There is a lot on this forum that should make you realise what is achieveable if you take the time and put your mind to it - we are all having to work harder and smarter for less reward. For the financially better times - you're gonna have to wait.
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