How best to Tile a room?

[mp3wizard]

Hi All,


I've just had an extension done and I'm wondering how best to tile the room, I am a novice and haven't tiled before, as if that wasn't hard enough, I am also fitting underfloor heating and dealing with 800mm by 800mm floor tiles.


From the attached picture I am looking to tile the red lined areas, I haven’t got any kitchen or bathroom fitted so the floor is completely free for tiling, the only obstacle in my way is the soil pipe in bathroom and a few radiator pipes, I was intending to mark the size of soil pipe on the tile and use an angle grinder to cut the shape out on the tile, would you agree this is the best method? And for the radiators to cut out a square piece and cut the remainder of the small piece of tile to put behind the pipe and use a filler for any gaps?


From the research I have done, a lot of people advise to start from the centre of the room, but because the living room, kitchen, bathroom will all be the same tile and I want it to flow and I wonder if starting from the centre of the living room is really the best idea?


I have been told that it would be a good ideal to use a levelling compound or levelling boards, for the underfloor heating, but It’s a new wood floor fitted with big wooden sheets, which is quite level and underneath that is 100mm in insulation boards, so my plan was to coat the floor in some heatflex which is a primer used to stop heat escape for underfloor heating, then the underfloor heating mats, and then the mapei adhesive recommended for the tile, then the tile and grout as normal.


The tools I’ve got for the job are;

Electric Wet cutter, dry cutter (800mm wide), mixing trowel, 6mm notched trowel, plastic scraper for grout, grout float, 2 mixing buckets, sprit level, 3mm tile spacers, suction grabber, 4 hard sponges, heatflex primer, adhesvies and grout, tape measure, square edge.


I’d appreciate any input as I’d like a good finish and if there are any additional tools that you think I might need.

Thanks a lot.

Mark

 

[mp3wizard]

firstly thanks for taking the time to write,

I was told that I should buy a 12mm trowel earlier,

well as i'm laying on big boards not floor boards, is that still relevant? I'm not sure what brick bond is, today is the first time I've realized i'll need the levelling boards, so i'll have to do some research.

Mechanical cutter is Jokosit Professional Tile Cutter 800mm/80cm Plus Extra Titanium Gold Tile Blade

Wet cutter is Vitrex 113402NDE 450W Torque Master Tile Saw 240V

The adhesive is - Keraquick white fast setting adhesive 20kg x 5

The Grout is - keracolor sf 100 white grout 5kg x 1

I realise that i'll have to do small areas because the adhesive sets quickly.

I have read somewhere that for small grout lines of 1mm the floor would need to be very stable and a high quality tile, seeming its a level floor which will have levelling boards and I believe the tiles are high quality could I reduce my grout line?

 

[Simons70]

You can change the adhesive for slow set,give you time to set right.

 

[WetSaw]

Take the fast set adhesive back and get standard set, it'll have gone off in the bucket before you've got your first tile laid. White grout on a floor isn't usually the best idea either as it won't stay white for long! 3mm is the British standard for floor tiles.

 

[Old Mod]

First things first, honestly, I'd suggest you exchange your adhesive for a standard set.
You won't cope with a rapid with those tiles.
You'll be mixing one batch per tile probably,
and you'll have no time to makes adjustments if needed.
Measure your tiles from corner to corner diagonally, that'll give you an indication as to how good they are. They should measure exactly the same on both axis.
That's two measurements per tile, both diagonals.
Measure a few and make sure the result is constant.
Then lay them face to face and see if they are flat. If they're not, they will rock or spin about the centre.
That'll indicate how you'll need to apply adhesive.

 

[Old Mod]

This is brick bonding the insulation boards.
And taping the joints. It's a scrim type tape, covered with tile adhesive.

 

[mp3wizard]

it's from Tile Mountain, i'll have to see if they will exchange.

if they do come back as consistent after measuring could I reduce my grout line?

Yes i'm living in dream land where I think no-one will actually walk on the tiles, they'll just gaze from afar at how nice it looks

great ok, thanks for the pic, so providing its taped at joint I can use the tile adhesive I already have.

 

[Dumbo]

it's from Tile Mountain, i'll have to see if they will exchange.

if they do come back as consistent after measuring could I reduce my grout line?

Yes i'm living in dream land where I think no-one will actually walk on the tiles, they'll just gaze from afar at how nice it looks

great ok, thanks for the pic, so providing its taped at joint I can use the tile adhesive I already have.[/QUOTEtwice you have been told British standard minimum for floor joints is 3mm

 

[mp3wizard]

Yes British standard, but I've seen other forums that say if they are high quality tiles with optimum floor levelling it can be reduced to 2mm.

 

[Two-Trowels]

If not already mentioned, invest in some levelling clips, you'll be glad you did. Definitely go over your UFH wires with SLC, it will protect the wires from any mishaps with the trowel etc while you're tiling, follow the installation instructions to the letter with the UFH, particularly the bit that says check the mat after each stage with a multi meter. Don't forget to back butter the tiles.

 

[Old Mod]

The insulation boards have nothing to do with the adhesive you use, no.
You need to change your adhesive to a standard/slow set.
Your existing floor, is it completely stable?
Is there ANY bounce anywhere?
Get a totally brim full glass of water, place it in various locations around your floor and walk around it and see if it spills.
And don't tip toe so that it doesn't.
You should be able to try and make it spill and it not!
You can't do anything else until you have a sound base to start with.
If these basics are not followed, it will end in tears!

 

[Old Mod]

And stop fretting about joint size, you're too far ahead of yourself for now.

 

[mp3wizard]

I hear you,

well I took some advice from earlier and I ordered some Deltaboards, I personally think it would of been ok but everyone said that I need it so I bought it.

Self levelling compound aswell... can I not just be extra vigilant and lay a good layer of adhesive?

 

[Ttt1601]

SLC protects the wires, your using a metal trowel. It does have sharp corners, plus it guarantees you fully encase the wires, it's what most on here do if not all. It's the best way

 

[Dumbo]

It is easier to go over floor with slc then tile after and there are also other benefits

 

[mp3wizard]

ok cheers, well I will try to fit the insulation boards this weekend and start with the rest the weekend after

 

[Old Mod]

Under floor heating or UFH.
It has several purposes.
It gives a far better transference of heat from cable to tile.
It should give you a flat surface to tile to.
And as already mentioned, will protect your cables from accidental damage.

UFH wires NEED to be fully encased for them to be efficient and to prevent them burning out.
Covering them with tile adhesive does not perform these tasks well!!
You may think you you've covered them or fully encased them, but you're just as likely to have not.
If there was a divided opinion on here I could understand your hesitance, but there isn't.
I appreciate it may look like another expense, however, as has already been stated, the cost of the extra adhesive required will also mount up fast.
If the UFH is laid with dilligence then the cost of the slc will be kept to a minimum.

 

[Flintstone]

Is this a wind up?

 

[Dumbo]

He is like a Person who goes around and asks everybody opinion until they get the opinion they were looking for in the first place probably best if he doesn't use slc hey and maybe go one step further and but joint the tiles

 

[mp3wizard]

you know it is disrespectful to refer to someone as a third party when that person is around,

I wouldn't expect you to come into my job today and be able to do what I do, but I would make allowances if you were trying to learn, when I have a much better level of expertise than someone I offer them a helping hand up rather than look down and mock them.

anyway, I'm very grateful for all the advice, so thanks.

 

[Flintstone]

My advice would be to take it all on board and do what your being advised by highly skilled and experienced tilers, and not to think oh there is no need for this that and the other. I think that's what is coming across from you.

 

[Dumbo]

you know it is disrespectful to refer to someone as a third party when that person is around,

I wouldn't expect you to come into my job today and be able to do what I do, but I would make allowances if you were trying to learn, when I have a much better level of expertise than someone I offer them a helping hand up rather than look down and mock them.

anyway, I'm very grateful for all the advice, so thanks.

What would you think if the person you were offering a helping hand was saying what if I do it this and you not knowing it is not so good told them again and they then said again what if I do it this way . Also I have changed engines in cars brakes on vans clutches in tractors . Engine rebuilds including fitting an alternator. It is a different sort of skill they only fit one way . If it wrong they won't go back together . You can get a long way into a tile job when you can then realise it is going wrong .

 

[Dumbo]

Maybe I should say I started life as an agricultural engineer before starting work with a tiling company who taught me the job and then started me on the easy work when tiling was a lot simpler

 

[mp3wizard]

I hadn't realised I came across like that, if that's how it appeared then I understand some of the reactions, even if it doesn't sound like it I have taken everyone's comments on board and will be following it to the letter.

 

[Simons70]

I hadn't realised I came across like that, if that's how it appeared then I understand some of the reactions, even if it doesn't sound like it I have taken everyone's comments on board and will be following it to the letter.

Apart my first advice!

 

[mp3wizard]

yeah apart from that lol

 

[Italy]

Apart my first advice!

only advice that I still feel to give

 

[Martyn Leeds]

Can't wait for the pics, work-in-progress and the final results..

 

[gamma38]

My advise for you is do not do it. You will regret it when it goes wrong, and make no mistake it will go wrong. It takes years and years to learn a skill/trade. A job like this has so many potential pit falls that you need all those years to keep it from going wrong. Why is it that people use the line we have run out of money so we are having a go at the tiling ourselves?? as if tiling isn't good enough to be a paid skill. Just browse this forum for jobs like this that have gone wrong.
Just my thoughts....

 

[Dan]

I haven't read the whole thread. But the amount of materials you require is quite a bit. If you got a professional tiler in, perhaps they can provide you with their trade discount on all the materials, and then you pay them to do it, meaning you'd get a professional job done, and the total cost would be little more than what you'd pay for materials and your time anyway?

And then of course, it won't go wrong. Which means it'll be cheaper in the long run by far!

Just thinking out loud.

Another option I've seen done, is a customer got a tiler around as a consultant, who kinda project-managed the job and kept popping in at each stage and advising. Think he helped with some of the tricky tiles that needed cutting around shapes and things, and the tiler got paid for his time etc and the job still gone done right, just slowly.

Worth considering all options. Because if that goes wrong, you'll be gutted.

 

[mp3wizard]

I've bought all the materials and equipment so I will be doing it myself.