Adjudication and BS5385 for bad tiling work - TilersForums.com

[jasonh15]

Hi

I had a large extension done by a builder under JCT Minor Works (not home owner) which was designed and speced by an architect under a seperate contract.

A large limestone tiled area (nearly 70m2) was laid over wet underfloor heating set in screed and the tiles have subsequently cracked within 6 months with long linear cracks that span across the room.

No expansion joints were put in, no seperation layer was used, the UFH was not comissioned between the screed drying and tiles being laid and the screed was only allowed to dry for about 4 weeks. Doing my research since I have found these faults contravene the BS5383 standards for tiling.
I have tried to settle this with the builder but he will only take 40% fault and believes the architect is just as much to blame as him so I am being forced to adjudicate against the builder. I do not have a right to adjudicate against the architect.

Does anyone know if I can use the BS standard in the adjudication as evidence of his errors. Does the builder have to work to that standard or is it just a guide he can ignore. I am keen not to start a costly adjudication that I can't win.

 

[jay]

hi one question why is the architech at fault

 

[jasonh15]

Hi

My builder believes the architect is at fault for not specifying the expansion joints or seperation layer in his drawings. Also for not referencing the BS standard BS5385

The builder accepts the blame fully for the screed mistakes.

 

[mikethetile]

:welcome:

Hi Jason

we are not encouraged to give legal advice on this forum as its a tiling forum not a legal forum

but from experiance I would suggest you take legal action against your builder

it is the builders responsability to ensure the work is done to a "proper and workman like manner"

bs are the minimum standard that a job has to be carried out to, falling below bs the job is substandard

bs cannot be dismissed by a builder

contact your solicitor as you have a strong case against your builder, pm Dave and he will find a pro tiler near you that will visit and make a report

this may sound drastic when all you want is your issue resolved, but from my experiance once a builder starts apportioning blame to others theres no way back and you will need to find someone else to rectify the works

mike

 

[jay]

ha what a crock did architect specify door handle heights think the builders barking up wrong tree a tradesman would know the standards and do it right the standards are there as a guideline or reference but will stand in court

separation layer what type of screed have you got will need more info here
expansion joints are down to the tiler to place as per standards

 

[jasonh15]

I had a report done by Webers. The tiles came from Stonell and they arranged for Webers to do it.
It said that lack of expansion joints was the main reason and it needed redoing with weber mesh tech over the screed.

The screed is reinforced but beyond that I've no idea.

The room does have a lot of glazing so can get large heat variation in the room which might be a factor also.

Ajudication is the cheapest route for me to get recourse from the builder and also its the specifiied dispute resolution clause in the JCT contract that was used.

 

[jay]

1 okay the screed is just concrete !
the ufh wasnt comisioned before tile instalation
2 how thick is the screed
3 when you used the ufh what temp did you set it at to start with
as mentioned cant help legaly
some pics might help
4 is there any expansion joints at all if so how far apart

 

[jasonh15]

Thanks Jay.
Answers:
1. Possibly not sure - it looks like it has fibres in it
No the UFH was not commissioned before tiling (it was tested before the screed was poured just to check for leaks etc)
2. Around 70mm
3. Once we moved in it was not touched for maybe one month as it was summer. After that the UFH was turned on gradually over approximately 6 weeks to its max temperature
4. Just a perimeter expansion joint. The whole area is about 10m long and between 5.5 and 7.5 m wide.

 

[jay]

thanks do the tiles sound hollow when tapped

 

[jasonh15]

no not hollow
the weber guy took tiles up and there is cracking in the screed that aligns with the tile cracks
he believes the cracks are lines of pressure since no relief that would be provided by expansion joints and seperation layer