Electric Underfloor Options And Mosaic Tiling

[davidsmerv]

Hi guys, I have a customer who wants to put electric underfloor of approx 3m2 into a 6m2 bathroom with a timber floor. No big problem there I hear you all say....lol.

The tiles they want to use are whats causing me some concern or rather the build up to the tiles I should say, they have picked a mosaic made up of round pieces of shell (aaahhhh cant remember the correct name for it but im sure youll get my drift) which are around 2mm thick. Normally at a time like this I would be going straight for Ditra heat or similar but of course that wont work with the mosaic on top.

So the dilemma is how to go about it rather than run for the hills!!!!!!!

My thoughts are as follows providing the timber floor is sufficiently strong of course;

• Lay heating cables on top of floor and cover with a layer of self levelling
• Bond a 6mm cement board of some description onto this with tile adhesive to give a flat and true surface for the mosaic
• Possibly using BALs new uncoupling mat below tile (anyone any experience of this???)

Im not sure what you will all think of the layer of board on top of the self levelling, ideally it would be good not to have it but I think it could be difficult to get the surface of the self levelling good enough for the tile in question.

I also want to ask has anyone any experience of any of the low build up water based underfloor systems that seem to be around now like this one Thermotube | Low volume hot water underfloor heating system designed for use with renewables.

Any thoughts or ideas welcome
Cheers

 

[Tile Shop]

Are the mosaics shell all the way though, or is it shell faced marble?

 

[davidsmerv]

As far as I remember Paul they are shell all the way through and they are only around 2mm thick, I can check if you think theres an issue with them

 

[Flintstone]

I don't see what the problem is? Do a good job of the leveling and tile on it with the mosaic, simples! I wouldn't put a board on top of the wires whatever you do.

 

[Old Mod]

You have checked their suitability for job in question haven't you?

 

[Stef]

6mm thermal boards glued & screwed to the deck, heat mat fitted, slc the lot & then stick tiles on top provided they are suitable for a floor.

 

[Tile Shop]

Can you tell us where they are being supplied from? gonna do some research on this.

I've had a look through Original Styles range. Some of theirs are only 2mm pure shell, but they advise wall only. Another thing you'll enjoy...... Their recommendation for adhesive and grout is Epoxy. Fingers crossed your are different

 

[Lee@emctiles]

as a few have said, check the mosaics are fit for floor purpose.

i like @Stef way of doing the floor, but also think one of your first options, a ditra heat type system (other makes are available ) would also work. you could fix matting with a flexible adhesive, lay matting and wire then back fill with flexible tile adhesive.

 

[Old Mod]

as a few have said, check the mosaics are fit for floor purpose.

i like @Stef way of doing the floor, but also think one of your first options, a ditra heat type system (other makes are available ) would also work. you could fix matting with a flexible adhesive, lay matting and wire then back fill with flexible tile adhesive.

Would that work Lee?
What about point loading?
It's a genuine question mate, not querying it.
I'd of thought maybe u'd need a 2-3mm latex over it.

 

[davidsmerv]

Ditra heat is not suitable for anything less than 50mm in size, I am being told by the retailer that the tiles are suitable but now that has been said I am going to double check.

The problem I can foresee with going straight onto the slc with the tiles is that unless im doing something wrong its difficult to get a completely flat even surface with the slc, believe me ive tried on many occasions and theres always some imperfections in it, and with it having heating cables buried i would be reluctant to start surface grinding etc to remove them. Hence the 6mm board to provide a good surface.

 

[Flintstone]

I'm not great at getting a perfectly flat surface with slc but I think I mix it too thick, when you see a perfect looking floor with slc it looks very watery.

 

[Old Mod]

I'm not great at getting a perfectly flat surface with slc but I think I mix it too thick, when you see a perfect looking floor with slc it looks very watery.

If u follow the directions exactly on bag most are fine.
Or use an SLC without fibres, it'll flow better.
Something like rapid level 30 is perfect example.

 

[Tile Shop]

Original Style range me back this morning after speaking to their technical people.

With regards to their shell, big no no on floors with or without UFH as its too soft and crumbly. Strictly walls only Any further info on where these other mosaics are coming from? Range or tile name would also be good if poss.

 

[Lee@emctiles]

Would that work Lee?
What about point loading?
It's a genuine question mate, not querying it.
I'd of thought maybe u'd need a 2-3mm latex over it.

hands up, think you are correct here........however, checked with technical at thermogroup (variopro) and theyve said cover variopro with SLC and theyve not an issue with the size of tile used (can be mosaic)

however does sound like this mosaics isnt fit for floor use.

 

[Old Mod]

hands up, think you are correct here........however, checked with technical at thermogroup (variopro) and theyve said cover variopro with SLC and theyve not an issue with the size of tile used (can be mosaic)

however does sound like this mosaics isnt fit for floor use.

No, but at least we answered our question! Haha

 

[Stef]

I got a flyer through from Ardex & they have a photo of Ditra with slc getting poured on top of it.
I meant to phone Schluter as I was told back filling or slc on top of Ditra was a big no no.
Things may have changed though.

 

[Old Mod]

I got a flyer through from Ardex & they have a photo of Ditra with slc getting poured on top of it.
I meant to phone Schluter as I was told back filling or slc on top of Ditra was a big no no.
Things may have changed though.

Last I spoke with them Stef, they're happy with around 5mm over the mat.

 

[davidsmerv]

Guy from retailer was off today so ill try to get him tomorrow to see where they come from although they are likely to be something high end as they cost over £200 m2, I found other mother of pearl mosaics online by Siminnetti which they say are suitable for walls and floors so suspect they are something along these lines.

 

[Flintstone]

I have a job on the go and they want 2mm mother of pearl mosaics in the wet room tray, the rest of the floor is 12mm marble,

 

[Unused Account 1]

Anyone got a nd200 wet cutter ,could you measure your water tray please and let me know cheers as need one for tomorow no time to get new one ,just get something similar once i get the size thanks

 

[Tile Shop]

slightly off topic

But to answer your question, 300L x 200W x 60D (mm)

 

[Unused Account 1]

Thanks paul not sure how to start a thread not to clever on computers ,thanks for that see if i can just get a plastic box that size

 

[Old Mod]

Thanks paul not sure how to start a thread not to clever on computers ,thanks for that see if i can just get a plastic box that size

all u need to do is go to the main forum page by clicking site logo.
Scroll down to appropriate forum. Click into it, and top right it says post new thread, click it and follow prompts! Easy.
To answer your question a wicked 9inch paint roller tray works.
When Mark @whitebeam logs on tonight, thank him, that's where I got info for you.

 

[White Room]

The reason I use a 9inch tray is the shallow end protrudes out from the cutter and all you do is top up the water when the level drops.....simples