Tile Spacers and Grout lines

[Droopy]

And Dunlop ?

Yes, Dunlop too.

 

[DHTiling]

For the backerboard thickness, Dave?

That is the min' we can recommend for overboarding, so I think it must be.

I know that BAL recommend 10mm for floors james..but is it a BS standard or just BAL guidline for their guarantee..?

 

[Droopy]

I know that BAL recommend 10mm for floors james..but is it a BS standard or just BAL guidline for their guarantee..?

Now that you have said that Dave, i am not so sure.

But I was under the impression that it is a BS.

And that in fact all our 'guidelines' were all based on BS's.

Though maybe Gaz or Danny could help clear this one up...

 

[DHTiling]

Now that you have said that Dave, i am not so sure.

But I was under the impression that it is a BS.

And that in fact all our 'guidelines' were all based on BS's.

Though maybe Gaz or Danny could help clear this one up...

Now that's interesting james......because BS5385 doesn't state that you have to use an addititve( polymor) in standard or rapid setting cement based adhesives when tiling to concrete floors( un-heated etc ), but BAL now say this....

So that means that ......

1. CTF3
2. Gold star
3. Rapid set
4. Super cover
5 . ptb

all have to have AD1 added for tiling to concrete....to have BAL's guarantee.....

Now there is a difference to giving a guarantee and it bieng a BS standard...don't you think..?...

Now that BAL have added this issue to using there adhesives then i think that they need to let customers know where they stand...or do they just continue using there products as normal and with NO guarantee's....?..

 

[GazTech]

I know that BAL recommend 10mm for floors james..but is it a BS standard or just BAL guidline for their guarantee..?

This is only a guideline for Bal guarantees, if BS changes to this as we know BS is only a guideline anyway and not a rule....Gaz

Now that's interesting james......because BS5385 doesn't state that you have to use an addititve( polymor) in standard or rapid setting cement based adhesives when tiling to concrete floors( un-heated etc ), but BAL now say this....

So that means that ......

1. CTF3
2. Gold star
3. Rapid set
4. Super cover
5 . ptb

all have to have AD1 added for tiling to concrete....to have BAL's guarantee.....

Now there is a difference to giving a guarantee and it bieng a BS standard...don't you think..?...

Now that BAL have added this issue to using there adhesives then i think that they need to let customers know where they stand...or do they just continue using there products as normal and with NO guarantee's....?..

It is down to customers to seek the advise of the professional doing the job or the adhesive manufacturer. In the not too distant future cement based adhesive not enhanced with polymers will be a thing of the past..IMO

 

[Droopy]

Now that's interesting james......because BS5385 doesn't state that you have to use an addititve( polymor) in standard or rapid setting cement based adhesives when tiling to concrete floors( un-heated etc ), but BAL now say this....

So that means that ......

1. CTF3
2. Gold star
3. Rapid set
4. Super cover
5 . ptb

all have to have AD1 added for tiling to concrete....to have BAL's guarantee.....

Now there is a difference to giving a guarantee and it bieng a BS standard...don't you think..?...

Now that BAL have added this issue to using there adhesives then i think that they need to let customers know where they stand...or do they just continue using there products as normal and with NO guarantee's....?..

I think that is down to the fact if you have a concrete floor, unless it is suspended concrete floor, it will more than likely have a S&C screed over it.

So here, the 'concrete floor' is refering to suspended concrete floors, so in this case nothing has changed.
As BAL have advised that AD1 be added to those adhesives, for that type of flooring system, in the past too.

But I will try to clarify that tomorrow when I am down is Stoke.

EDIT.

Regarding the use of these on concrete/dense blockwork, again AD1 has been the recommendation in the past too.

But I do take your point about guidelines, which Gaz rightly points out BS are too.

 

[Droopy]

This is only a guideline for Bal guarantees, if BS changes to this as we know BS is only a guideline anyway and not a rule....Gaz

Gaz, I think I might have picked up DW wrong in a conversation regarding 6mmV10mm tile backer board with this.

My bad.

 

[GazTech]

Gaz, I think I might have picked up DW wrong in a conversation regarding 6mmV10mm tile backer board with this.

My bad.

I raised the question with Bal 2 years ago while at Topps, I didn't think 6mm Hardibacker was thick or strong enough to be structurally suitable to avoid deflection on timber flooring. Bal said they would only recommend 10mm boards with SPF back then, as a consequence I would only sell Fastflex with 6mm overlay if height was an issue with my customers...Gaz

 

[Branty]

I think here in lies the problem.
BAL have taken the technical data available on cement boards. As far as we are concerned 6mm is not strong enough.
Now other adhesive manufacturers, may say they don't have a problem with cement board of 6mm thickness.
IHO they are basically saying, 'if the cement board manufacturer is saying 6mm is OK for floors, then you can use our products'.
If you have a failure on one of these floors, the only guarantee an adhesive manufacture has to uphold, is on their adhesive.
So they'll take away a sample of their adhesive. If it meets up to their formula, they will assume (and rightly so) that the problem was something on site beyond their control. If thats 6mm cement board, then you're left to take that up with the manufacturer of the board.
Just my opinion.

 

[Droopy]

I think here in lies the problem.
BAL have taken the technical data available on cement boards. As far as we are concerned 6mm is not strong enough.
Now other adhesive manufacturers, may say they don't have a problem with cement board of 6mm thickness.
IHO they are basically saying, 'if the cement board manufacturer is saying 6mm is OK for floors, then you can use our products'.
If you have a failure on one of these floors, the only guarantee an adhesive manufacture has to uphold, is on their adhesive.
So they'll take away a sample of their adhesive. If it meets up to their formula, they will assume (and rightly so) that the problem was something on site beyond their control. If thats 6mm cement board, then you're left to take that up with the manufacturer of the board.
Just my opinion.

You see, that was my take on it too.
But i also thought that BS's were there to help manufacturers of different things like backerboards and adhesives to find some common ground to base recommendations on.

Maybe, as yet, they have yet to come to an agreement between all these manufacturers that allows them to set a min standard for backerboards.
But it seems i made a mistake in thinking they already had.