Bathroom Skimming Prep With Pva Before Tiling (wet Areas)

[Crumbs]

Hi, i am looking to re tile my bathroom and have got rid of all the tiles. Unfortunately some plaster damage has occured, i want to skim the damaged areas and use PVA between skim coats.

I know using PVA is a big mistake before the tiling in a wet area, but is it okay to use PVA before a skim coat when its in a wet area (shower above a bath)?? Does the same apply or is it safe?

Much appreciated

 

[Russel]

You will need to be the judge of how much moisture it will absorb or be in contact with. Plaster looses its structure and goes soft and mooshy with allot of water contact, especially if trapped between tiles and the plaster.

If its moisture vapor thats likely to evaporate then I think the PVA should stay set. Most on here would just say use an SBR though. Most building merchants have it and tile shops.

 

[Andy Allen]

Yes PVA the walls before you skim them.
Then when the plasterers has dried I would tank the walls before tiling.
Just don't use PVA as a sealer before tiling.

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Just SBR them then use a cement based tile adhesive to float over the damaged areas.

 

[White Room]

Try some of this before skimming then saves using pva Febond Blue Grit

 

[Russel]

Just SBR them then use a cement based tile adhesive to float over the damaged areas.

Thats exactly what I wanted to say but thaught I would get shot down in flames on here. Tiling adhesive for repairing damaged areas and even creating thin smooth surfaces for mosaics is awesome!

 

[Crumbs]

Cheers lads, i wanted to keep the wall as level as can be as its meant to be easier to tile plus my tiles are under the 20kg limit so i should be good. Ill put the PVA down then before coats, wasnt sure if it was ok as everyone was pointing out how much of a mistake it is to use prior to tiling but guess the skim covers it up.

Which primer would you guys opt for Bal Acyrlic Primer or Bal SBR Bond primer? Seem pretty much the same to me apart from the SBR seems to have better water proofing properties? Once you primed, do you need to tile within a period of time? much appreciated

 

[Andy Allen]

Just remember not to use PVA to seal the walls before tiling . You can use any acyclic primer....if you want to waterproof the walls then you need to tank them the acylic primer will offer very little waterproofing compared to a paint on tanking kit.

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Thats exactly what I wanted to say but thaught I would get shot down in flames on here. Tiling adhesive for repairing damaged areas and even creating thin smooth surfaces for mosaics is awesome!

Don't you worry about any of the old farts on here!
Say what you want it's the only way to learn and they can only ban you.
By the way it's thought and it's not that awesome! And exclamation marks are my thing !

 

[Crumbs]

Yea i got that Andy, thanks bud

I did consider tanking it but its confusing what products to buy. This is only a shower above a bath setup, would good quality water proof adhesive and grout not suffice?

Money is on the tight, i did look at the Bal WP1 but seemed just a component of a kit, could the WP1 on its own be applied, would that offer good protection? Any other products you guys could recommend? Cheers

 

[White Room]

Yea i got that Andy, thanks bud

I did consider tanking it but its confusing what products to buy. This is only a shower above a bath setup, would good quality water proof adhesive and grout not suffice?

Money is on the tight, i did look at the Bal WP1 but seemed just a component of a kit, could the WP1 on its own be applied, would that offer good protection? Any other products you guys could recommend? Cheers

I do, I buy a fleece from B&Q for stopping plants getting sunburned (Truth) and it costs me about £3 for something like 6 m2. Cut strips for the corners and fold onto shower tray.

 

[LM]

Yea i got that Andy, thanks bud

I did consider tanking it but its confusing what products to buy. This is only a shower above a bath setup, would good quality water proof adhesive and grout not suffice?

Money is on the tight, i did look at the Bal WP1 but seemed just a component of a kit, could the WP1 on its own be applied, would that offer good protection? Any other products you guys could recommend? Cheers

The correct advise here is to either do it correctly or don't do it at all. Gypsum skim is probably one of the worst substrates to tile on because of its limited weight tollorence, the fact that it causes chemical reactions with powdered adhesive and that its most certainly moisture sensitive. To answer your questions in this instance BAL APD is more suited to what your doing, SBR is more suited to sealing the back and edges of plywood etc. You say your budget is tight, but if you don't tank the walls your simply wasting your money long term anyway and it will end up costing you additional money to fix the damaged that will occur from not having tanked your walls. Spend the extra £50 or so and tank the walls, it'll be the best money you'll spend on this project. You also need to make sure that you've dealt with the joint between the bath and the tiles properly also. Here's some of the materials you should consider
Classi Seal ® Flexible Waterproof Upstand
Or if the bath is already fitted
All About Sealux Shower and Bath Seals for UK and Ireland
Then over lap either with this
BAL Waterproofing Kit | Tiling Products | BAL Adhesives
Hope this helps

 

[Crumbs]

Thanks alot bud for the info, much appreciated. Your right and think i will tank the walls.
Yea skim is proberly not the best idea ive had but its my 1st tiling attempt and i've been told skimming it to make a flat surface will be easier for me. My tiles are around 11kg per m sq before addy so hopefully ill be ok on the weight, if i had time where i could pull the walls down id put in tile backer boards in but its a heavily used room and i dont want my head on a plate.

I like the look of the sealux seal, where do you get yours from as i cannot find where i can actually buy it. I think thats where water got in before, the link between the bath and the tiles.
What addy / grout would you recommend Lee? prefer tubbed, Cheers

 

[LM]

Thanks alot bud for the info, much appreciated. Your right and think i will tank the walls.
Yea skim is proberly not the best idea ive had but its my 1st tiling attempt and i've been told skimming it to make a flat surface will be easier for me. My tiles are around 11kg per m sq before addy so hopefully ill be ok on the weight, if i had time where i could pull the walls down id put in tile backer boards in but its a heavily used room and i dont want my head on a plate.

I like the look of the sealux seal, where do you get yours from as i cannot find where i can actually buy it. I think thats where water got in before, the link between the bath and the tiles.
What addy / grout would you recommend Lee? prefer tubbed, Cheers

Online Crumbs, try this site
PVC Trade Shower Bath Trim Five Pack All UK

You can't use tubbed addy with tanking suystems, the adhesive will not cure, it would remain like it does in the tub.
Get yourself any c2 rated adhesive to be on the safe side from any reputable brand: Tilemaster setaflex and grout 3000 get good reviews on here or any BAL, Mapei powdered products etc.

Make sure you install the Sealux trims before you tank the wall though

 

[Crumbs]

Sorry I have been away, coming back to finish this job now, thanks for the info bud, much appreciated.

I think I will go with this tanking product http://www.NoLinksToThis/p/mapei-shower-waterproofing-kit/78484
What do you think of this product? Can you tell me do I have to start tiling in a certain time frame once its applied?

As for the addy - I could do with one that doesn't require to be applied quickly as I am a novice to it all. I am struggling to know if bagged ones are suitable for waterproofing products or not, or are they all suitable if they are in a bag? Sorry bud for all the questions, much appreciated

 

[White Room]

Sorry I have been away, coming back to finish this job now, thanks for the info bud, much appreciated.

I think I will go with this tanking product http://www.NoLinksToThis/p/mapei-shower-waterproofing-kit/78484
What do you think of this product? Can you tell me do I have to start tiling in a certain time frame once its applied?

As for the addy - I could do with one that doesn't require to be applied quickly as I am a novice to it all. I am struggling to know if bagged ones are suitable for waterproofing products or not, or are they all suitable if they are in a bag? Sorry bud for all the questions, much appreciated

I'd be using a single part flexible...

 

[LM]

Sorry I have been away, coming back to finish this job now, thanks for the info bud, much appreciated.

I think I will go with this tanking product http://www.NoLinksToThis/p/mapei-shower-waterproofing-kit/78484
What do you think of this product? Can you tell me do I have to start tiling in a certain time frame once its applied?

As for the addy - I could do with one that doesn't require to be applied quickly as I am a novice to it all. I am struggling to know if bagged ones are suitable for waterproofing products or not, or are they all suitable if they are in a bag? Sorry bud for all the questions, much appreciated

No trouble at all Crumbs.
The Mapei tanking kit is perfect, just make sure you follow the instructions and use the primer etc.
The following adhesive is a good one to use, but as with all these products you'll get them cheaper in a tile outlet.
http://www.NoLinksToThis/p/mapei-keraflex-tile-adhesive-white-5kg/42841
This is a standard set adhesive and will give you a few hours to work with it, just mix up small batches and use this grout
http://www.NoLinksToThis/p/mapei-ultracolor-plus-grout-white-5kg/71681
Make sure you also follow the instructions on this grout and make it up in small batches
There's no time frame in which you have to tile on the tanking kit, so long as its cured it's ready to go when ever you are.
When you spread your walls also back butter the back of each tile with the flat side of the trowel
Remember once you have installed the Sealux trims, overlap the vertical edge of the trim that's against the wall with a length of the tanking tape running horizontally around the bath first, then put a vertical piece in the internal corner overlapping the horizontal piece of tape, this is pressed into your first coat of paste with a small roller or a trowel edge, once thats dried give the whole area a second coat of paste let it dry and tile it when you want.
Hope this helps

 

[LM]

opps don't know what happened there my computer done its own thing lol, just do all that the once and it'll be fine lol

 

[LM]

I'd be using a single part flexible...

Mark are you at it too lol

 

[Old Mod]

opps don't know what happened there my computer done its own thing lol, just do all that the once and it'll be fine lol

Deleted for u mate.

 

[Crumbs]

Top man, cheers Lee, you are a wealth of information Them products look ideal, cheers

I found a cheaper tanking kit online, what about this one? Will be tanking onto skimmed walls, was at the low price compared to Bal / Mapei Aquaseal Wet Room System 4.5m2 Kit

Would the adhesive & grout you linked be okay with this tanking kit would you say?
Also stupid question i bet but best be sure, do i need to prime the tanked walls before tiling? thx bud

 

[bcd-87]

Yea i got that Andy, thanks bud

I did consider tanking it but its confusing what products to buy. This is only a shower above a bath setup, would good quality water proof adhesive and grout not suffice?

Money is on the tight, i did look at the Bal WP1 but seemed just a component of a kit, could the WP1 on its own be applied, would that offer good protection? Any other products you guys could recommend? Cheers

BAL WP1 is very good

 

[LM]

Top man, cheers Lee, you are a wealth of information Them products look ideal, cheers

I found a cheaper tanking kit online, what about this one? Will be tanking onto skimmed walls, was at the low price compared to Bal / Mapei Aquaseal Wet Room System 4.5m2 Kit

Would the adhesive & grout you linked be okay with this tanking kit would you say?
Also stupid question i bet but best be sure, do i need to prime the tanked walls before tiling?
thx bud

That one will do the job.
Make sure and prime the walls with the primer that's in the pack and do not dilute it.
That particular kits paste takes longer than most to cure so don't necessarily be planing to tile the next day, make sure it's fully dried.
Also it comes with a self adhesive tape, so after your primers dried and you've gave the walls their first coat of paste, let it dry completely before you install the tape, be careful with it and take extra time because once you pull the backing paper off the tape and it touches itself it's scrap because you can't separate it again. Align the tape in a dry run first with the backing paper still on to get your measurement for the length of tape you need. And when you install the tape you want it to cover the holes on the vertical piece of Sealux.
Once that's in then give it your second coat of paste making sure to soak the mesh at the edge of the tape with paste.
The adhesive and grout is perfect for this and no, you don't need to prime the cured tanking paste, good luck

 

[LM]

BAL WP1 is very good

I think it's the best, it and Ardex obviously,but you get what you pay for

 

[bcd-87]

I think it's the best, it and Ardex obviously,but you get what you pay for

haven't used ardex yet

 

[LM]

haven't used ardex yet

They're more or less the same thing in different boxes, after all it's the same chemists that design them all for Ardex and BAL

 

[Crumbs]

Top man thanks, got the kit today so will be having a bash this weekend - was planning on filling the bath 3/4 volume and using clear silcone around the bath to the wall.

After that, would you suggest to install the tape while the bath has this volume left in it as well?
Do you guys normally seal the grout afterwards? Maybe OTT?? Much appreciated

 

[LM]

Top man thanks, got the kit today so will be having a bash this weekend - was planning on filling the bath 3/4 volume and using clear silcone around the bath to the wall.

After that, would you suggest to install the tape while the bath has this volume left in it as well?
Do you guys normally seal the grout afterwards? Maybe OTT?? Much appreciated

If your using a sealux pack in conjunction with a tanking system then you don't need to seal the bath to the wall, that's taking care of by the correctly installed sealux pack.
It'll do no harm to half fill the bath, but you don't need to with sealux.
If you like seal your job with Seal guard aresol sealer

 

[Crumbs]

Thanks pal, only issue i am concerned about now is the gap between the wall and the bath, shower end its about a cm and a little less on the other 2 walls - hopefully the tanking kit is ok with this gap as any demos of it seems fairly flush against the wall. Will post some pictures

 

[LM]

Thanks pal, only issue i am concerned about now is the gap between the wall and the bath, shower end its about a cm and a little less on the other 2 walls - hopefully the tanking kit is ok with this gap as any demos of it seems fairly flush against the wall. Will post some pictures

Crumbs that's what the seal pack is for,it'll eliminate any gap up to about 15mm.
Did you get a seal pack?