How Do I Break Down Keraquick

[nick giles]

hi folks.

i have a nasty situation.

i have lifted around 19 tiles which had been badly laid by a previous tiler,

the tiles came up ok, but there is keraquick cement based mapei glue stuck solid to the floor
with an electric heat mat under......

so i cant hit it with hammer and chisel.......

has anyone come across a solvent or other system which has successfully broken
down the glue without the need for brute scraping.

i have tried soaking it in water and pva... some thoughts about citric acid but not sure..

deep in the mire.
so any help would be gratefully received.

cheers.

Nick.

 

[Tile Shop]

I would try to grind most of it down to less than 1mm.... Then hit it with neat solution of LTP Grout Stain Remover (yep... works for addy too) and a wire brush.. If you need something a little more heavier duty, you could try the HG Limex.

Thats all I've got.

 

[Old Mod]

Is this a patch repair or a complete floor?
If it is a repair, I have used abrasive flap wheels, and grinding cups before.
It's very messy, and you need a light touch.
You can take the adhesive back enough to apply a new bed.
Is the UFH in slc?

 

[nick giles]

Is this a patch repair or a complete floor?
If it is a repair, I have used abrasive flap wheels, and grinding cups before.
It's very messy, and you need a light touch.
You can take the adhesive back enough to apply a new bed.
Is the UFH in slc?

yep its a repair, 19 tiles out of roughly 70. very messy. grinding 80 grit flaps sound a good idea.

just have to be so careful with the heat mat ( which is in about 10mm slc ) but as you know even with slc you get areas where the heat mat pokes up and is covered with tile glue.

thanks. Nick.

 

[Stef]

yep its a repair, 19 tiles out of roughly 70. very messy. grinding 80 grit flaps sound a good idea.

just have to be so careful with the heat mat ( which is in about 10mm slc ) but as you know even with slc you get areas where the heat mat pokes up and is covered with tile glue.

thanks. Nick.

Has the heat mat been tested to make sure it's working?
If it's covered in slc & done correctly then there shouldn't be any wires sticking up.

 

[Dan]

It won't just be 19 tiles it'll be all of them eventually. Lift them all up, self level on top of the adhesive, and retile it using a good tiler.

Www.tilersforums.com/directory

 

[One Day]

19 out of 70?!
Crazy to repair. Just replace everything. Trust me - it will be quicker...

 

[nick giles]

It won't just be 19 tiles it'll be all of them eventually. Lift them all up, self level on top of the adhesive, and retile it using a good tiler.

Www.tilersforums.com/directory

I agree, but that will be a 5k job, skirtings off, kitchen island out, lift 1500 quid worth of heat mat tiles, glue and self levelling..... nasty. i have to try a repair first up. The client is aware that it will need to be done properly in a couple of years, but if it lasts... then great.
I know it is a rip up and start again job, but i dont have professional indemnity insurance, and i dont walk away from jobs, but i also dont have the time or money to start again.

 

[nick giles]

I agree, but that will be a 5k job, skirtings off, kitchen island out, lift 1500 quid worth of heat mat tiles, glue and self levelling..... nasty. i have to try a repair first up. The client is aware that it will need to be done properly in a couple of years, but if it lasts... then great.
I know it is a rip up and start again job, but i dont have professional indemnity insurance, and i dont walk away from jobs, but i also dont have the time or money to start again.

I agree, but that will be a 5k job, skirtings off, kitchen island out, lift 1500 quid worth of heat mat tiles, glue and self levelling..... nasty. i have to try a repair first up. The client is aware that it will need to be done properly in a couple of years, but if it lasts... then great.
I know it is a rip up and start again job, but i dont have professional indemnity insurance, and i dont walk away from jobs, but i also dont have the time or money to start again.

It won't just be 19 tiles it'll be all of them eventually. Lift them all up, self level on top of the adhesive, and retile it using a good tiler.

Www.tilersforums.com/directory

i should come clean and admit the fundamental fault. big kitchen diner with 5x 25mm plywood sheets laid on to new joists at 40mm centers with regular dwangs/noggins. so its a solid floor, but due to a lapse in brain particles, no mat or cross ply was used to stop flex or movement in the floor, latex in the keraquick might have helped, but we just used water. I am experienced enough not to have made these mistakes, but hey we all have bad days.... just wish this had been on a piddly bathroom floor and not a showpiece kitch diner. plywood was primed with primerg, so there is nothing else wrong, ie lifting tiles etc.

 

[WetSaw]

i dont have professional indemnity insurance

 

[nick giles]

professional indemnity is not public liability which is required by law, of course i have that!! indemnity is when you make a genuine mistake which has consequences too expensive to cover.

 

[LM]

Has the island got a stone work surface, if so support below it to the sub base will be needed to support the weight or that joisted floor will keep on sinking. Just a thought

 

[One Day]

Marcrist make a small grinding cup for carefully removing adhesive residues.
On a variable speed grinder with a dust shroud - that's how I would remove the adhesive.

You do know Keraquick is cement adhesive - not "glue"?!
It can't be dissolved by anything short of alien blood.
You will HAVE to grind it out.

 

[Stef]

So the floor is 25mm ply on top of joists then heat mat & slc?
No other overboarding?

 

[nick giles]

So the floor is 25mm ply on top of joists then heat mat & slc?
No other overboarding?

yeah, fraid so.... its a busted flush

 

[Stef]

yeah, fraid so.... its a busted flush

Almost destined to failure.

 

[Stef]

yeah, fraid so.... its a busted flush

Almost destined to failure.

 

[WetSaw]

No need to rub it in....

 

[Dan]

Sounds like it won't just be the 19.

 

[nick giles]

yeah, fraid so.... its a busted flush

So the floor is 25mm ply on top of joists then heat mat & slc?
No other overboarding?

Sounds like it won't just be the 19.

aye, its not a mistake i would normally have made, but i took on the whole house renovation with labourers and a crap joiner.... so i got distracted... i have prob lost 10k already on the job, so another 5k hurts like f. cest la vie.... now working for a company to pay debts... on the plus side my boss bought me a sigma - what a beautiful tile cutter... makes porcelain seem like ceramic. ps how often do you boys change the wheels on a decent cutter... would you change it after one big porcelain job ?

 

[Dan]

They don't need changing anywhere near that often. Just don't press on too hard on any tile type and it should last months.

 

[Stef]

My everyday Sigma 3b3m has the original wheel in it, 5 years roughly I reckon.
Still cuts like the day I got it, give it a quick spray with wd40 silicone spray & it glides.

 

[nick giles]

My everyday Sigma 3b3m has the original wheel in it, 5 years roughly I reckon.
Still cuts like the day I got it, give it a quick spray with wd40 silicone spray & it glides.

my first porcelain job with it.... cut fine for around 20m2 then started to chip the glaze ... although the labourer was using it,,, so could he have been applying too much pressure and blunted the wheel?

 

[Dan]

Sounds like it. You don't need to score heavy. Sometimes you can't even see the score mark but it's there.

 

[nick giles]

Sounds like it. You don't need to score heavy. Sometimes you can't even see the score mark but it's there.

this was porcelanico from crocatile in glasgow.... they kindly told the client it was ceramic.... (insurance job only priced for ceramic ) more fun and games... two tilers had walked off the job already till muggins here got called in... i said i could do it, but buy me a sigma

 

[Stef]

my first porcelain job with it.... cut fine for around 20m2 then started to chip the glaze ... although the labourer was using it,,, so could he have been applying too much pressure and blunted the wheel?

You ain't going to blunt a Sigma wheel after 20m2.
They last years.

 

[One Day]

My main cutter hasn't had a new wheel yet. 7 years old now. used most days. Keep 2 spare wheels in my glove box but i don't think I'll need them for a while...

 

[aussie tiling]

Hey Nick thats not a nice situation to be in, lm not rubbing it in but you have to be there to make sure everything is bang on no excuses. I have a solution for you. We are pricing up a job at the moment and the tiles have been down twelve months over piped UFH some are loose and all round they feel hollow so our assumption is they have been blobbed. There is no option of taking them up, so we are going to drill small holes in grout joints and inject it with resin then go over tiles with a seamless floor called micro cement, the customer wanted that originally but builder didnt have a clue. This job is from porcelanosa and they have just brought there own product out. I hope that helps

 

[nick giles]

You ain't going to blunt a Sigma wheel after 20m2.
They last years.

could

Hey Nick thats not a nice situation to be in, lm not rubbing it in but you have to be there to make sure everything is bang on no excuses. I have a solution for you. We are pricing up a job at the moment and the tiles have been down twelve months over piped UFH some are loose and all round they feel hollow so our assumption is they have been blobbed. There is no option of taking them up, so we are going to drill small holes in grout joints and inject it with resin then go over tiles with a seamless floor called micro cement, the customer wanted that originally but builder didnt have a clue. This job is from porcelanosa and they have just brought there own product out. I hope that helps

hi aussie, thanks for the suggestion but its the sub floor that is the issue, trust me there was no blobbing, having lifted the tiles i can see that the glue coverage underneath is excellent, very few weak spots in the adhesion coverage. only solution is to take up the tiles and the glue and the self levelling and the heat mat. hopefully the heat mat will make it easier to lift the self levelling so a sds breaker on an angle should lift it all. over lay with 6mm ply or a bal membrane, start again.

 

[One Day]

could

hi aussie, thanks for the suggestion but its the sub floor that is the issue, trust me there was no blobbing, having lifted the tiles i can see that the glue coverage underneath is excellent, very few weak spots in the adhesion coverage. only solution is to take up the tiles and the glue and the self levelling and the heat mat. hopefully the heat mat will make it easier to lift the self levelling so a sds breaker on an angle should lift it all. over lay with 6mm ply or a bal membrane, start again.

6mm ply?!