B&Q polished black "porcelain"

[Grace'sDad]

This all started with a quote for fixing 16sqm of black granite.
Over a few weeks it degraded into 16sqm of B&Q's finest.

I've got to admit, I seriously thought about walking away from the job once my customer told me that they could save so much money with these over the granite. I had read so much bad press on here about B&Q porcelain!

I kept my fixing costs the same and refused to drop the price, also warned and showed the customer that 1) they aren't square 2) they aren't very black 3) they need sealing before fixing / before grouting / after cleaning.

I started fixing yesterday and whadya know? They aren't too bad! They cut really nicely wet and dry.

I began by levelling the floor with a good SLC - this has allowed me to get a perfectly smooth floor.

Now I'm going to get flamed for this but...I didn't seal them before fixing!

Tested 3 tiles at random with adhesive / slurry / dust and water. They do stain easily but I found that they also clean up very well using the Plasplugs polished porcelain sealer (from B&Q - Naptha based) followed by slightly soapy water. So I figured it would be quicker to clean them all once fixed than seal them all beforehand.

Tomorrow when I start cleaning them properly will be the moment of truth though!

Bad points -
- not square, 1mm out on 2 edges.
- Stain easily (but appear to clean up ok)
- Slurry from cutting stains your skin like you wouldn't believe!

Two things I found out; according to one of our local shops these are made from soluble salts in China - not proper porcelain ingredients, hence the very porous surface. Also B&Q are now putting labels on all packs which state that they must be sealed before fixing / grouting / after cleaning. They've had loads of complaints seemingly.

Apologies for the long and waffley post - I'm knackered tonight!

Hope this is useful info though.

 

[Fekin]

I did a job with them in 400's, stained out of the packaging because they we're damp, but cleaned up ok, and I only layed them, cleaned them "washed" then sealed and they we're fine.

All in all a decent tile I guess, better than the sh*#* I've been using on the last bathroom, which was also B&Q's finest white ceramics:mad2:

 

[Grace'sDad]

Oh, forgot to say these are 400s not 600s.
Appear to be exactly the same material though.

Don't fancy 600s on my own - I think my back would snap!

 

[Fekin]

I looked at a job 4 days before christmas, B&Q black polished for a kitchen in 600's, customer to be was having kittens because she'd had a tiler booked in for weeks to do the job, he turned up, saw the size of the tiles and had stagefright with the sound of it "they we're 600's", customer had told him the size :lol: , tiler told them he didn't have a cutter big enough so couldn't do the job, so the customer said they would hire him one, then the tiler told them he didn't want to do it because of the size.

I went to look at the job, medium sized floor, well, summit like 12 sqm and I was packed out leading upto xmas eve, so gave a silly price and never heard from them again :lol: , there again, it was that kind of customer you just get the feeling that it could be a lot of hassle just getting paid once the job was done.

No one has since come at me with a tile of that size.

 

[Papa J]

Hello everyone.

Having bought a lot of these tiles for a few projects in our house, I was horrified to read the problems that some people were having with them. Fortunately, we had not yet laid them, so after reading a lot of the posts on various forums, we were in two minds whether to take them back to B & Q, dump them and start again, or really find the best way to deal with them. As we had no experience of dealing with this problem before, we decided to turn our front room into a mini "Good Housekeeping Institute" and test the best sealer/impregnator for the tile, which admittedly did cost a few quid, but ultimately has been worth the time and money. I thought it only fair that as this forum was the first to alert us about the problem, thankfully before the tile was laid, I would share the results of our little "experiment" with those who are interested.

Firstly, we tried Lithofin FZ Protective Impregnator which is water based, and says on the bottle it is meant for all porcelain tiles. Unfortunately, although this product is so easy to apply, it did not penetrate the tile at all and offered no repellent or protective qualities. In fairness, when I spoke to the manufacturers, they did tell me that some tiles will not take the product, so tough luck there.

Secondly, we tried HG Hagesan Impregnating Sealer. This seems to be an oil based product and whilst it did seem to offer a degree of protection to the tile, it still did stain with oil, wine & lemon juice. We did also try putting a HG stain protector both on top of the impregnating sealer and by itself, and although the combination of the 2 did work a lot better, it required a lot of elbow grease, and I mean A LOT!! Be warned, if you leave the Impregnating Sealer on for any longer than 4 minutes, it is virtually impossible to get off without using spirit thinners.It also has to be said that the HG product does not specify for use on polished porcelain, so this was a bit of a long shot.

Finally, after doing a bit more research, I paid a visit to Nicholls & Clarke, and although I obviously did not buy the tile there, they were incredibly helpful and ran through with me what they thought. They suggested that as I had tried the 2 previous products, I may as well try a product by LTP.
Well, I have to say that this baby certainly did the trick! It is spirit based with a fairly strong smell, so I would recommend opening a window when you use it. From what I can tell, although I may be wrong, it has a sort of wax suspended within the spirit base. You pour a little onto the tile, rub over in horizontal and vertical motion so you get entire coverage, and leave for 15-20 minutes. Then, buff off with a soft cloth until the waxy residue is pushed into the tile surface. It does take a bit of elbow grease to remove the excess, but the tile is left with a great sheen and is not particularly slippery afterwards, I assume because it is wax rather than an oil. We have given all the tiles a coat of the LTP Sealer prior to laying and will coat again once laid, but prior to grouting.

We tested the tile with lemon juice, oil, wine, coke, jam & water,( told you it was a bit like the Good Housekeeping Institute ), but as any of you with kids, or who are just messy in the kitchen will appreciate, it was really worth it. They were all left on for 1/2 hour and then wiped off. Guess what - no stains!! The oil needs to be blotted rather than wiped, as it just smears, but apart from that, no worries.
I assume it will need further treatments as the floor is subjected to the traffic in the kitchen, but I'll play that one by ear. It was recommended that for day to day cleaning, a product such as Flash should be used, but nothing acid or too harsh. I reckon LTP make a daily type cleaner that is suited to the sealer, but have not checked that one out yet.

Sorry to have rambled so much, but I thought it fair to share this info with you all. I'm sorry I can't be of much help to those who already have stained tiles, but for those of you who are considering whether to lay the tiles or not, this is my 2 penneth worth! I'm not a tiler, tile expert or anything like it, but I do like to find a solution to a problem and this is the best I came up with.

Good Luck!

 

[White Room]

Good post wether your a tiler or not

 

[Papa J]

Thank you Whitebeam. I meant to say that I spoke to a manager at the B&Q where I bought the tiles and he did admit to me that they had a lot of returns on these tiles, and quite a few angry customers. I did however discover the manufacturers website and they are actually produced by a Malaysian company by the name of Guocera
I have enclosed their Porcelain Tech Spec as a PDF attached to this post, for what its worth, but strangely they don't list the black 600 x 600 tile on their site. I wonder why............!??

 

[davy_G]

GD, what grout joint did you lay with for the 400's?
Did you stick with 5mm because if the irregular cal or close it up a bit? If so how did that turn out?

 

[craig t]

I think the 400s are better then the 600s i am sure the 400s cost in the region of 22m2 where the 600s cost 8m2. I don't fit the 600s but i have done a few jobs with the 400s and they cut fine on my ts60 and are not to bad shape or size wise. I used a 4mm gap instead of my usual 3mm just to make it slightly easier!

 

[david campbell]

used the 600's before and the customer insisted on a 2mm grout joint!
wow! i've never had so many probs with a tile or a customer,it's still the only job i've had trouble getting payment as the customer and her husband played 1 against the other and i was piggy in the middle(basically i explained the probs before i started to 1 and was told to go ahead,then the other had to pay me and wasn't happy said i should have spoke to them)
done them again and told customer i would only do it with 4 or 5mm joint because of previous probs,job ended ,customer very happy with work and advice,and a large tip before xmas followed!

 

[LM Ceramics]

ive worked with them once it was the 600s white polished porcelain only on a bathroom floor so they werent too bad i did the same sealed them after grouting it turned out fine but i kept them nice and clean

also just to add i did a travertine filled bathroom and i must say i was quite impressed with them

 

[Heardy]

Hi,All
Great site have a problem with 400x400 porcelain ties dusty layer trapped in the surface of the tile have tried several products from plasiplug and H.G dusty dos,nt quite do the job.

 

[Lyndsay Dart]

:juggle2:Hi there,

Me and the husband laid B&Q black ceramics. Look great when laid, then you seal them and they look horrible for ages. I was cleaning them with flash, but if you have smearing marks on the tiles (or sealant residue) REMOVED ADVERTISING
Hope it helps.

 

[JCT]

Did the 600 ones on a 23m2 kitchen floor. Used 2mm spacers. Found them easy to cut. Used hg sealer on them. Cleaned up well but found them very hard to keep clean. Footprints marks on them as soon as anyone walked on them.

 

[Grace'sDad]

GD, what grout joint did you lay with for the 400's?
Did you stick with 5mm because if the irregular cal or close it up a bit? If so how did that turn out?

Hi Davy, I used 3mm and it was fine.
This was last year though, so B&Q batches change......

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Hello all!

If I am right the 600x600mm tile from BQ is about £8-50/ metre!
Ratner said it the way it is - he can sell a silver dish for £25 because its ****!
I've fixed this tile on 3 occassions totalling about 50metres and I thought it was exceptional value.
JOHN.

 

[Dan]

This all started with a quote for fixing 16sqm of black granite.
Over a few weeks it degraded into 16sqm of B&Q's finest.

I've got to admit, I seriously thought about walking away from the job once my customer told me that they could save so much money with these over the granite. I had read so much bad press on here about B&Q porcelain!

I kept my fixing costs the same and refused to drop the price, also warned and showed the customer that 1) they aren't square 2) they aren't very black 3) they need sealing before fixing / before grouting / after cleaning.

I started fixing yesterday and whadya know? They aren't too bad! They cut really nicely wet and dry.

I began by levelling the floor with a good SLC - this has allowed me to get a perfectly smooth floor.

Now I'm going to get flamed for this but...I didn't seal them before fixing!

Tested 3 tiles at random with adhesive / slurry / dust and water. They do stain easily but I found that they also clean up very well using the Plasplugs polished porcelain sealer (from B&Q - Naptha based) followed by slightly soapy water. So I figured it would be quicker to clean them all once fixed than seal them all beforehand.

Tomorrow when I start cleaning them properly will be the moment of truth though!

Bad points -
- not square, 1mm out on 2 edges.
- Stain easily (but appear to clean up ok)
- Slurry from cutting stains your skin like you wouldn't believe!

Two things I found out; according to one of our local shops these are made from soluble salts in China - not proper porcelain ingredients, hence the very porous surface. Also B&Q are now putting labels on all packs which state that they must be sealed before fixing / grouting / after cleaning. They've had loads of complaints seemingly.

Apologies for the long and waffley post - I'm knackered tonight!

Hope this is useful info though.

Nice post mate. And nice to see B&Q getting some good out of their cheap chinese buys. We hear so much bad stuff.

I guess it wouldn't be accetable to have 1mm out if it wasn't b&q hey? lol That's a fairly square tile it seems after seaching on here for b&q.

 

[Viceroy]

All the tilers i speak to refuse to work with these now !
One tiler had to seal the tiles 3 times and they still stained !
There is now a piece of paper in stating that you have to also seal the sides of the tile before fixing ! One lady dropped a teabag on one and cannot remove the stain !
Good Old B&Q they might be cheap but not worth the grief from our point of view !

 

[Deleted member 1779]

My neighbour has been over a couple of times to see me about advice on these. We used the forum to pick out the best advice.

Some of the advice seems good but gaps are missing so I might put my thinking cap on (take some pics) and respond with more questions for you guys to the post.

He has questions like:
1) The plasplugs de-waxer that B&Q recommend.... Do you dilute it? The bottle has ml gradients on the side
2) What can happen if you forget to seal the side of tiles.

We are gathering thoughts and info so when this project is near complete I will whip out me camera...

R

 

[Grace'sDad]

I stand by my old post from last year re the 40x40 black which I fixed - they were bearable.
Now though I won't do B&Q polished porcs at all. I've found them to be too much trouble, bearing in mind that 99% of customers who buy these, do so because they are cheap - and that type of customer IS NOT going to appreciate the additional care/work which is required with them

I went out to quote a job last week and the (soon to be) customer had 3 samples of polished ivory porcelain. Two quality ones and one from B&Q.
He himself questioned why they were so much cheaper than the others.
I drew on them all with a blue chinagraph pencil and showed him how they stained - or didn't!
His own conclusion (and I will use this from now on) was that "there are nice jobs, then there is lino and lace curtains!"