Do I need to use Anti Fracture Matting

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Discuss Do I need to use Anti Fracture Matting in the Canada Tile Advice area at TilersForums.com.

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Lorenzo Antolovi

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38
Scotland
Hi all. I am looking for some advice on above subject. I am not a tiler but I intend on laying very large format 22mm slightly uneven hard limestone tiles inside on a concrete floor and want to know if I need to use this matting. The floor is 3 inch concrete, 100mm insulation on top and another 3 inches of concrete on top of that. This was done in early 2015 and we've been walking on it ever since. I can't see how it will be subject to movement and don't want to use the matting but I Sally would like some advice please. Many thanks
Lorenzo
 
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Lorenzo Antolovi

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38
Scotland
Hi, thank you for your response. Had a hectic day so sorry for taking so long to reply. The concrete came premixed from a cement truck. It was sand, cement and aggregate. It may have even come with fibre reinforcement but that was 4 years ago and I honestly can't remember. The area I want to lay is 6m square hallway which leads to a 14m square boot room. There are absolutely no cracks anywhere or deterioration of any of the concrete. Before I laid wooden flooring in the 36m square sitting room, there was no cracks in that rooms concrete floor either.
 
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ar2ro

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LONDON
It's two ways to make sure if limestone even 22mm can't crack special if it's there under floor heating. The best way will be lay down Schluter ditra25 matting or self-levelling compound min 5mm with fibreglass mesh. And very important to prime floor before lay any stuff before lay any powder compound including tiles adhesive. PVA is not good!
The best stuff it's this:

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Lorenzo Antolovi

TF
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38
Scotland
Hi Wilder. Thanks for reply. There is no underfloor heating. And I'm going to go with your recommendation. I don't want to over complicate my first job unnecessarily.

Been trying for last two days to find this post. I'm new to this site and forums in general so that's why I took so long to reply. I'm rubbish at navigating this stuff.

Could you Also help with the following. I tried to post it but the system told me I need to include at least one valid member and I don't know anyone so can't post it.

Hi, I was wondering if anyone can recommend a decent brand of tile levelling kit. The tiles are limestone. 22mm thick and some probably thicker, roughly 560mm x 850mm, I will be leaving a 10 to 15mm wide joint. Any recommendations would be very much appreciated. I have searched but I can't find anything that can deal with the specifics of my job.
Many thanks
Lorenzo
 
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Bill

Lorenzo Antolovi said:
Hi, I was wondering if anyone can recommend a decent brand of tile levelling kit. The tiles are limestone. 22mm thick and some probably thicker, roughly 560mm x 850mm, I will be leaving a 10 to 15mm wide joint. Any recommendations would be very much appreciated. I have searched but I can't find anything that can deal with the specifics of my job.
Many thanks
Lorenzo
Click to expand...

For joints that wide you will not need a levelling kit, just use a 60cm/100cm spirit level. I know in the photos below I am using a 180cm level but for the next row, I start with a shorter level.

If your floor is sub level enough, then you should have no problems getting a reasonably level floor with spirit levels. Grade the stone into thickness as that will help.

Frodsham Barn-10001-2.jpg Frodsham Barn-10002-2.jpg Frodsham Barn-10010.jpg Frodsham Barn-20005.jpg Frodsham Barn-20006.jpg
 
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Lorenzo Antolovi

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38
Scotland
Hi Tom. Thanks for that. I plan on using a 10mm or 12mm notched trowel for adhesive. Hopefully this will give me enough depth for adjustment. I have just measured the gap between some of the slabs that I layed out just to see them, and the gap is 20mm, erm smaller than this for there slabs just does not look that good but please correct me if this is just too wide. Also do I need a special cleaning product to clean off residual grout from the stone after grout has cured sufficiently or just old fashioned elbo grease.

15491040209363900217181036702000.jpg
 
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Lorenzo Antolovi

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38
Scotland
Happy days. I'm quite clean, at least I'll try be as clean as possible. I've got 10 litres a of sealer so I'll put a coat on first anyway. 're the concrete sub floor. We have hoovered it over the years but never really washed it. How clean does it need to be before I put down a couple coats of primer. Basically do I need to get down on my hands and knees and scrub out all the doggy mess stains, food stains etc.

Also do I need anything more than the following to make any part of installation easier or better.

10/12mm notched trowel
Mixing bucket
Mixing paddle (drill mounted)
Couple sponges
Couple buckets water for cleaning
15/20mm spacers
Long spirit level

I think I will load a heavy duty bag with grout, cut hole in corner and squeeze grout into joints. Will I still need a grout float to smooth it over and do a 45 degree sweep. I think that's it, if I need anything else please let me know.

Also thank you for all the advice and info, it's really encouraging.
 
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Bill

Personally, for that type of limestone and the joint width, I would use silver sand and cement. (save a lot of money too)

If you are not comfortable with that idea then you need to find a specific wide joint grout variety - there are plenty on the market.

Do try and work as clean as you can and you should be able to seal those after laying but before grouting. Always do a test in an inconspicuous area.

A 10mm trowel is not enough and I suggest getting a 20mm round notch like this one

20mm x 15mm U Notched Extra Deep & Extra Long Trowel £11.69 + VAT in stock - next day UK delivery plus Tile Cutters and Tiling Tools - https://www.tradetiler.com/20mm-x-15mm-u-notched-extra-deep-extra-long-trowel.html

Back butter the slabs too.
 
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Lorenzo Antolovi

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38
Scotland
Cool, good advice I'll get the bigger trowel. However I have already purchased 5 x 25kg bags of Kerakoll Biofast rapid set (£26.28 per bag) and 3 x 10kg bags of Tilemaster 3000 flex grout for wide joints. If I use 20mm trowel does that mean I have to get another 5 bags of adhesive. The area is 19m2.

The second question is, the primer arrived yesterday "Kerakoll Eco A" 10 litres in total. There is allot of talk on the product about Anhydrite based substrates etc etc. I looked on their website and I can't figure out the dilution rate with water. Does anyone have any clue on this. My subfloor is bog standard concrete from a mixer wagon. Hope someone can help and thanks for previous replies.
 
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Lorenzo Antolovi

TF
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38
Scotland
Right I have 125kgs, looks like I should get another 2 bags, maybe even 3. Well the savings I made on the tile (£26/m2) have been very useful as this is starting to get expensive. Wish I new about the silver sand and cement before, but I'm committed now. Also once I collapse the ridges of the adhesive anyone know roughly how high the tiles will sit on the mortar.

Cheers all.
 
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