DIY Tiler - 90 sq m of large format porcelaine tiling making me nervous!

[PJPro]

Hi!

I'm having a new extension built on my house. In fact, I've spent today putting in the CAT6 ethernet network (cables and conduit) and bashing through the old gable wall to join the two lofts. But that's another story.

My wife also ordered the 600x400mm porcelaine floor tiles (10mm thick) from Topps. I've got 90 sq metres coming by the end of the week. I am growing more than a little nervous about the laying of these tiles. I've got the porch, hall, dining room and kitchen floors downstairs to do, as well as the downstairs toliet (walls and floor). I've also got the floor and walls of the upstairs bathroom to do.

I'm going to be under pressure to be quick as the other trades are going to be waiting for me to finish before the 2nd fix carpenty and plumbing goes in.

I'm expecting the upstairs bathroom to be a special challenge. It will contain a quadrant shower enclosure with on wall mixer. The bath, basin and toilet will be placed against a low wet wall of about 1m high, containing all the pipework. The basin and toilet will be hung off this wall using Gerberit installation frames and a hidden cistern. The bath has wall mounted taps.

So. My worries. Well, the main one is making sure I'm doing things right.

The floor will be a moisture proof chipboard, topped with hardybacker. Do I need anything else? Should I also put down a waterproof membrane? How about the joints of the hardybacker? Do I need to use waterproof membrane on the walls/floor of the shower? How about the dry lined walls generally? Should I seal them with something like uPVA before tiling?

I've read with interest some of the banter over Sigma and Rubi dry cutters. The 3B or TX-700-N look good. But are these really going to do the business in the hands of a novice like me or should I be looking to buy a wet saw? I've used a (cheap) dry cutter before, many years ago, without much success.

I'm very worried about cutting the hole for the toilet flush plate. It's a fairly large affair (Gerberit - Kappa). How on earth am I going to cut such a big hole in a porcelaine floor tile? Using a jigsaw? mg_smile:

Clearly, I've got a lot of holes to drill. Are those Porsadrills really my best bet? I was shocked to see that each bit lasts long enough for two holes before it's ready for the bin. I do have a large drill press.....does this give me other options?

I'm fairly practical and can turn my hand to just about anything. I used to be a skilled labourer in my younger years and I am a qualified (but inexperienced) plumber. I'm hoping with a bit of good advice and encouragement I can pull this off. :hurray:

Grateful for any comments.

 

[PJPro]

Was it a good night though..:lol:

It was OK. And I don't feel too bad this morning.

 

[PJPro]

This morning I installed the UFH. It was a bit of a faff, TBH. The kit was a little on the small side so I had to unstick everything and space the wires out wider. I used masking tape for the layout as there didn't seem much of the silver tape. Given the layout issues, I'm glad that I did. Moreover, the masking tape served to pick up the dust as I peeled it off meaning the silver tape tended to stick better. The silver tape is a bit narrow and it's fairly difficult to easily cover the heating wire. So, the UFH took a lot more of the day than I had estimated.

I then reviewed my setting out. Although the tiles are rectangular, the joints would meet up every six tiles long two walls and with every joint on the other two. So I wanted to make sure the floor was not going to cause implications for the walls. I've had to make some compromises, with some tiles being a lot smaller than I would have liked. I just hope that I'm going to be able to cut them OK.

I then started to lay the tiles....a big moment that all turned into a bit of a panic. Getting the measurement right and understanding how much addy to actually knock up was the first issue. Given the size of the tiles, I've settled for half a bag to two measures of water from a plastic jug (of unknown size) seems about right. Unfortunately, when we came to mix it, my trusty drill which I bought when I was about twenty, started billowing smoke. It's a quality drill but just isn't up to the job of mixing half a bag of addy. Fortunately, the plasterers left their mixer on site, so we used that instead...it worked fine. So it looks like I'll need to buy a mixer!

The actual laying wasn't too bad. The UFH wires made it more difficult than it would have been without them...but the all the whole tiles are now down. There are 11 of them. They went down pretty quick (or it seemed it). I've spent some time after the laying wiping off the addy and scraping out the joints and it is clear that the tiles aren't precisly flat (they are level) and the odd wide joint. The latter can only be due to irregular tile size...or that the odd tile is out of square. It's not the prrefect job I would have liked but not too bad for a first attempt.

I'm just waiting for things to harden off a bit before adding the cut tiles. There are 11 of them too. I've decided not to tile all the way under the bath otherwise I'd have 16 to do.

 

[White Room]

Was there a primer to use with the ufh

 

[PJPro]

Yes....but I didn't use it as I am using NMP.

 

[DHTiling]

This thread has 2408 views... good hey..

 

[doug boardley]

time for some more pics PJ:smilewinkgrin:

 

[PJPro]

I finished the whole floor the other night.....at 01:30 in the morning. It was dark. I was tired. But I had to get it down to protect the UFH. As a result the finish is not what I was really looking for.

I bough a paddle mixer yesterday and it arrived this morning. I went for the Sparky 1360. It's a German make, so should be good. First impressions are also good. I feels well made. I wanted to go for a Refina (their warehouse is down the road at Poole) but just couldn't stretch the budget that far.

 

[jay]

you need to take your time and try not to work in the dark remember you will have to look at this floor from now on patience

and as Doug says time for some pics

 

[Bathfix Bob]

What do you do for a living PJ?
Just interested...

 

[Bathfix Bob]

PJ?
How's things going, we're all getting worried. I hope you haven't resorted to hammer and bolster yet.

 

[ScottG13]

I, like most have been following this thread but its all gone quiet for a while. Guessing PJ has been busy busy

 

[PJPro]

What do you do for a living PJ?
Just interested...

I am a senior engineering manager for an aerospace company. I have a background in software.

I went back into education at around 27 after doing a number of jobs; metal worker, van driver, motorcycle courier, order picker, skilled labourer, etc. I took a National Diploma, a degree (BSc Hons) and a second degree (MSc). During my education, I worked for nature conversancy groups as an estate worker and for a county council.

After completing my education, I worked for the government as an ecologist / modeller / software programmer before joining the aerospace company for whom I currently work.

Despite my academic background, I've always been good with my hands. I tend to be able to do lots of things well but rarely excel at anything.

 

[PJPro]

The work is progressing well, if slowly. I'm taking my time on the walls. I do have lots of pictures (of the entire job) but haven't had any time to post them. I will try and do something this weekend.

 

[Andy Allen]

hows the tiling going?

 

[Bathfix Bob]

Wow Aerospace?

My freinds son does a similar thing but he had to sign the official secrets act I think.

I'm glad the jobs going well.

 

[PJPro]

When I installed the UFH, I followed the instructions on the pack. Once I had taped down the loose wires, I tiled straight over the top. However, I've seen a few posts which refer to SLC with regard to UFH. What is SLC and should I have used it? What's the impact of not using it?

 

[kilty55]

slc is self levelling compound

it will encapsulate the ufh and protect it,say you needed to change a tile a year down the line due to a breakage then it will be easier to remove it

also going over the wires with adhesive can leave hot spots...areas uncovered

 

[DHTiling]

When I installed the UFH, I followed the instructions on the pack. Once I had taped down the loose wires, I tiled straight over the top. However, I've seen a few posts which refer to SLC with regard to UFH. What is SLC and should I have used it? What's the impact of not using it?

Nothing as long as you fully enbed the wires into adhesive,,

 

[Bathfix Bob]

How's progress PJ?

I suppose no news is good news.

 

[PJPro]

OK. I've got the night off so time to post some pictures (in between ordering doors, lights, etc).


Tanking the shower area in the dark.


The completed job.


My re-installation of the wet wall


The loose wire UFH goes down.


D'ya remember that night out...



The floor tiles being laid


Floor tiles almost done...


But not under the shower......


.......or the bath.


Starting on the wall tiles


and getting addy all over the new shower tray


A bit more progress




With all this downstairs to do.

I've actually made a little more progress than the pictures suggest. One wall is now completely tiles and doesn't look too bad. Had a few problems yesterday with the addy being too wet. We seem to be getting a fair few lumps as well despite a real thorough mixing with the paddle mixer.

 

[kilty55]

hi pj pro are you adding the addy to the water and not the other way round?

 

[DHTiling]

Looking good and thanks for the pics..

 

[PJPro]

hi pj pro are you adding the addy to the water and not the other way round?

Yep Addy to the water.

 

[doug boardley]

you keep it nice and tidy PJ

 

[PJPro]

I do have a problem looming. Despite the time I spent thinking about the setting out, I neglected to consider the tiles above the wet wall and the thickness of the window cill which sits on top of it.

If I tile down to the cill, I'm going to have the problem of a tile which is too thin. Tiling behind the cill doesn't seem right somehow. I'd have to increase the height of the wet wall considerably if I want to avoid taking slithers off a large tile to make it fit and lowering the height of the wet wall is impossible.

I do have some "detail" travertine mosaic tiles which I wanted to fit as a course right round the wall but just couldn't get the setting out right if I used them. Maybe I can use them to get myself out of a bind somehow? I need to give this more thought.

 

[DJS]

Doing yourself proud there PJ...well done. Sounds like the mosaic could be a good idea, but your right to give it more thought.

And yep, I do remember nights out like that in pic5! lol

 

[EFC Mike]

One word PJ - Impressive!:hurray:

 

[PJPro]

Work progressing very slowly at the moment. Was ill for a couple of days, so no proess at all on those days. I am currently working around the window. Got a couple of slithers to deal with (the cill is the same height as the wet wall) and have been agonising over the fitting of the trim around the window.

I tilied the reveals first and then planned to tile the wall and fit the trim then. It's not really working out. Don't get me wrong.....it's not bad just not perfect. If I were to do it again, I'd tile the walls first and fit the trim and then tile the reveals to suit. Still, I can use that lesson learnt when I tile the downstairs cloak.

Oh, and the spark was round today and we have lights! My wife isn't keen on the downlighters we've gone for. They're OK in the bathroom but not so good in the hall. They don;t light the whole room somehow and can be a bit blinding. I'm hoping things will improve when the walls are painted white.

Oh and the downstairs has been screeded. They used a retardant so it's taking a while to go off. And they added some fibrous stuff yo help it bond together. They've made a pretty good job of it and it nicely covers the wet UFH.

The PM is keen that we buy the doors so they can get on with the second fix chippy work but I'm delaying as I need to buy quite a few and want to avoid storing them any longer than I have to....especially when the wet trades have just finished.

When I get time, I'll post some more pictures. Hopefully, you'll be impressed!

 

[DHTiling]

Look forward to them..

 

[PJPro]

Actually, I have a question. The foreman/plumber have suggested I tile to the bath rather than behind it. Is this the best way to do it?