Is my tiler using the correct adhesive ?

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G

graybags

My wife decided that my tiling wasn't up to scratch in the ensuite and therefore got a pro in for the main bathroom.................but I'm not sure that he is !

The tiles are Instal Bianco porcelain 450x250 and for a start he appears to have primed the walls (a mix of aqua-panel, plasterboard and plaster) with PVA and is using a ready mixed BAL adhesive (BAL grip) which I think is acylic based , when I thought that you should use a cement based powder adhesive to mix yourself for porcelain tiles.

Please tellme that I am worrying unnecessarily !
 
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G

graybags

I regret that my wife does not want to offend him and having seen two jobs done for friends of hers was impressed with the finish (of which I have no complaints). He has done 5 courses on two walls,which will stay put, but remainder will be done with cement based powder adhesive and an acylic primer. Fortunately PVA was only used on the short external wall. I know the tiles should all come off and start again, but I can do without another major barney with the Mrs and at least this way if they do drop off I am totally in the clear and can say I told you so !
 
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T

tile55

graybags said:
I regret that my wife does not want to offend him and having seen two jobs done for friends of hers was impressed with the finish (of which I have no complaints). He has done 5 courses on two walls,which will stay put, but remainder will be done with cement based powder adhesive and an acylic primer. Fortunately PVA was only used on the short external wall. I know the tiles should all come off and start again, but I can do without another major barney with the Mrs and at least this way if they do drop off I am totally in the clear and can say I told you so !
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If you and your wife are happy, then that is the main thing. Hope all goes well for you.:yes:
 
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H

Highlander

graybags said:
I regret that my wife does not want to offend him and having seen two jobs done for friends of hers was impressed with the finish (of which I have no complaints). He has done 5 courses on two walls,which will stay put, but remainder will be done with cement based powder adhesive and an acylic primer. Fortunately PVA was only used on the short external wall. I know the tiles should all come off and start again, but I can do without another major barney with the Mrs and at least this way if they do drop off I am totally in the clear and can say I told you so !
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Sorry mate this dont "offend him" wont wash with me. How you going to feel if you hear that some kid ended up in hospital with a fractured skull because this clown has continued to use tubbed gear and pva on porcelain tiles????
The guy might be old time and thinks this is the way he has always done it. He might be a great tiler just not up to speed on product knowledge by pointing him to this site or just by getting him to call the Bal or whoevers helpline will help years of grief for future customers.

As for your wife mate youcan let her know at least the job you did was done right even if it did not come to her standard.

And if the tiler wants to debate the issue tell him come on here and leave a message for Highlander and we will see who will win the debate :smash:
 
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D

doug boardley

Highlander said:
Sorry mate this dont "offend him" wont wash with me. How you going to feel if you hear that some kid ended up in hospital with a fractured skull because this clown has continued to use tubbed gear and pva on porcelain tiles????
The guy might be old time and thinks this is the way he has always done it. He might be a great tiler just not up to speed on product knowledge by pointing him to this site or just by getting him to call the Bal or whoevers helpline will help years of grief for future customers.

As for your wife mate youcan let her know at least the job you did was done right even if it did not come to her standard.

And if the tiler wants to debate the issue tell him come on here and leave a message for Highlander and we will see who will win the debate :smash:
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well said Gary, I agree with you 100%+ all the way!:punk:
 
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G

garretridge

i did job back in october full bathroom with large format tiles and the tile shop supplied tub addy with the tiles dont no why had to tell customer that he needed cement based addy and i wouldnt do it without it, so i supplied it the tile shops should know better,and the tilers first job is to know what adhesives to use on any job dont let him ruin any more give him the boot!:incazzato:
 
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L

LM Ceramics

definetly the wrong adhesive has been used as pointed out and luckly all the walls might have been pva d but there are a few tilers i know who still use pva as a primer and will not be told different i too confess before i joined this forum i was a pva user but then i quickly realised that this was wrong there are alot of decent tilers out there that arent up to scratch on the preparation of tiling. thats why i think this forum is priceless without it i would have continued to be a pva user and a bog standard site basher.

maybe if you tell your tiler to come on this forum he may see the light as i did myself im always prepared to listen and take on board new techniques and advice if i go wrong this forum did me the world of good
 
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L

LM Ceramics

graybags said:
Just as a matter of interest LM...................how many of yours dropped off over the years ?!
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to be honest none that i know of but in time they could do so i cant condone the use of pva but ive learnt not to use it as a primer as i said there are tilers who still use pva.

i think the pva v primers thread was all the info i needed to stop using it
 
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G

graybags

Thanks to everyone for their very helpful comments. I contacted BAL and was given similar advice,very speedily and efficiently, so top marks to them. Interestingly, whilst not saying as much, the inference was that the tiles might hold, but in what was described as a picture frame effect. I am going to ask the tiler to remove a few tiles in the shower area, which is the area of most concern to me to see if the adhesive in the centre has gone off or is still tacky and then take it from there. Another point made by BAL was that they advise against tiling on bonding plaster, but no explanation as to why.
 
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D

DHTiling

Bonding coat should not be tiled to...it isn't stable enough to hold tiles....and the picture frame effect is true...as far as the air can get it will dry and thats it.......some moisture will soak into the substrate but thats it...Also when pva is used it forms a skin and dose not impregnate the substrate like primers do....so when you apply a dispersion adhesive etc it wets the pva ,,thus making it live again and nothing really holding the tiles in place....so if the pva formed a skin on the substrates surface then thats all the tiles are held with..

Primers seal the substrate from sucking moisture from dispersion adhesives to quickly and with a portland cement adhesive it stops ettringnite reaction....

Those tiles might well hold...we are just trying to tell you the correct way it should have been done....as confirmed by the tech guy you phoned......
 
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G

grumpygrouter

graybags said:
If you read the thread you will realise that we have been there and done that. The PVA was binned long ago, along with the ready-mix. This guys tiling is spot on and I would have no hesitation in using him again.
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GLad you got all this sorted Graybags and that you have a job you are delighted with, and also that your tiler has also leaned something. You can be sure as shooting he won't pva again and I am sure he would be happy to do work for you again if you were to ask him.:thumbsup:
 
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