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IMPORTANT CHANGES TO BS 5385-1 WALL AND FLOOR tile

tile Standards | BS 5385​


As part of the five-year review of British Standards and reflecting changes within the tile industry since 2009 – BS 5385 Part 1: 2018 has now been published. One significant change made was to exclude the use of plywood as a background material for the direct fixing of ceramic wall and natural stone tiles.

Tiling Standards

Clause 6.1.2.7 Other sheets and boards (see also 6.2.3.3) now states:
“The use of sheets or boards that are subject to movement from changes in moisture content should be avoided. Plywood and other wood-based sheets or boards should not be used for direct tile”.

A significant uplift in the use of tile backer boards and a wide variation in quality of plywood available on the market has provided a solid case for the removal of plywood from the standards.

David Wilson, UK Head of Technical Services a member of the TTA Technical Committee said: “Previously it was recognised in BS5385 Part 1: 2009 that tile direct to plywood was possible, providing this was restricted to small areas and be “installed in such a way that they provide a [dimensional] stable and rigid background” the quality of plywood for tile purposes has decreased significantly with cheaper imports flooding the market.

“While higher quality external grade plywood is still available – it is significantly more expensive.

“It is important to consider though that that wood is a hygroscopic material which means that its moisture content will change dependent upon any changes in the environmental conditions on site. Therefore, dimensional stability of wood-based boards cannot be assured there is always a risk to installing ceramic or natural stone tiles onto plywood or other wood-based sheets,
Another technical consideration for wall tile is weight restrictions. Just as a side note at this point, if you don't have a clue what any of this is, then consider a tiling course, and research it well before paying any money. Plywood is deemed to have a maximum weight of tile per m² of 30 kg compared to proprietary tile backing boards which generally are capable of supporting heavier weights per m² of tile (As per table 3 of BS 5385-1: 2018).

British Wall and Floor tile Standards BS5385-1​


“A competitive tile backing board market means that prices are more attractive to tile fixers and contractors. This combined with the additional features and benefits of providing background for tile which are dimensional stable and resistant to moisture and thermal movement. “

However, while plywood is not recommended as a background for direct wall tile, it can still be used as a structural board when overlaid with a suitable tile backing board, particularly where installation of mechanical fixings is required e.g. for mesh backed natural stone where it is not possible to remove 75% or of the mesh backing.

Other changes to BS standards.

Previously in internal dry wall areas it was recommended that tile https://www.tilersforums.com/forums/tile-adhesive/ should cover a minimum of 50% coverage spread evenly over the back of the tile. However, driven by necessity, with the increase in the size and types of tiles i.e. larger formats and thin ceramic panels, now available of the market, BS 5385-1: 2018 advises: “Tiles with a surface area of less than 0.1 m², but which weigh more per square meter than 70% of the background’s capacity to carry the weight, should be solidly bedded e.g. the maximum weight of tile that can be supported by Gypsum plaster = 20 kg; whereas 9 mm thick porcelain tiles, which weigh approximately 18 kg/m², weigh more than 70% of 20 kg (14 kg) therefore, they should be solidly bedded regardless of their size”

British tile Standards included within the scope of BS 5385-1: 2018 are large format ceramic tiles, ceramic panels i.e. tiles with a surface area >1m² (any edge length >1200 mm) and thin tiles

i.e. ceramic tiles and panels with a panel thickness of ≤ 5.5 mm. To reflect this, additional changes have also been made in the minimum recommended grout joint width, dependent on the tile/panel size, e.g. the minimum grout widths vary by tile facial area – an example as follows:
  • For tiles with a facial area of less than 0.1m² with no side > 600mm long, a minimum joint width of 2mm is required.
  • Tiles with a facial area 0.1m² to 1m² with no side>1200mm long, a minimum joint width of 3 mm is required.
And
  • Joints between ceramic panels should be increased pro-rata to panel size (e.g. for a 3m long ceramic panels the minimum required joint width between these panels is 5mm.
Not included in the scope of BS 5385-1: 2018 are:
  • Natural Stone Slabs i.e. stone which is more than 12mm thick,
  • Agglomerate stone,
  • Metal, plastic resin, mirror or glass tiles of a similar construction
Note from Admin: We have collated most of the threads regarding tile standards. Having one thread on the subject should help those out seeking advice regarding British Standards in Wall and Floor tile BS 5385
 
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Dumbo

Why dont you contact both associations and ask them about their inspections and what they cover. If it wasn't in your builders terms I believe they can't insist who does the inspection. The tta probably won't cover the instalation of goods but to be honest the tile is probably going to be the most expensive part to correct .
 
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Waluigi

Just had a quick look and it looks like a genuine organisation. I also took a look at installers registered in my area and how to apply to become a member. An annual fee is required. If the company you have been dealing with is a member of BIKBBI (rolls off the tongue that acronym doesn’t it?! ;) ) then I’d be a little worried there is a conflict of interest there.
 
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Soso

TF
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Why dont you contact both associations and ask them about their inspections and what they cover. If it wasn't in your builders terms I believe they can't insist who does the inspection. The tta probably won't cover the instalation of goods but to be honest the tile is probably going to be the most expensive part to correct .

Thanks jcrtiling. I agree the tile will definitely be the most expensive as it will require removal and re-installation of goods as a consequence of needing to be re-tiled anyway. The trouble is that small claims court only covers up to £750 but the tile association with VAT included is £900 :(

The builder doesn't have anything in his terms so i think we would have to tell them which inspection we would agree to. I've just contacted the BIKBBI and they said they don't know if their inspectors use Tile association of BSI standards when doing their inspection. I asked about dot and dab and she hadn't even heard of it although i expect she is in admin rather than an inspector herself !

Just concerned their inspectors might think dot and dab is acceptable or wouldn't know the current industry standards
 

Soso

TF
Reaction score
5
Just had a quick look and it looks like a genuine organisation. I also took a look at installers registered in my area and how to apply to become a member. An annual fee is required. If the company you have been dealing with is a member of BIKBBI (rolls of the tongue that acronym doesn’t it?! ;) ) then I’d be a little worried there is a conflict of interest there.

Yes - agree. We are a little worried that maybe the builder knows someone there or knows the local inspector or something. This builder seems to be quite well known in the local area (not in a good way). Just also concerned that we want someone who can genuinely inspect tile issues thoroughly. I don't think the builder is a member but i do think maybe he has contacts either there or on the ground.
 
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Old Mod

Found this quite interesting, so with some help from @Paul C. this is what is contained within British Standards.

BS5385 part 1

"7.1.2 Bedding Materials
........ blah blah blah
Tiles should not be fixed using the dot and dab technique"

"7.2.1.6 Tile Joints
........ blah blah blah
Tiles should not be fixed using the dot and dab technique"
(why they put it again under tile joint, I have no idea)

Other than that it only mentions the methods to achieve as full contact as possible. no specifics.

This should weight the argument on your side.
 

Ash205

TF
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Morning all,
Have a question for the professionals out there
Just had my bathroom refurbished and everything was taken back down to brick etc , however whilst inspecting the work some of the tile just looks really badly done
Now the question is am I being to picky or is this a bad job ? According to the company owners who did the job the work is within industry standards ?!

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OP
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Time's Ran Out

Not acceptable!
Could hang my coat on some of those.
Get them back - problem is if they’ve left the aesthetics like that what’s behind the view?
 
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Dumbo

Call their bluff ask them for a copy of the industry standards they are referring to because that lippage clearly isn't with British standards which is 1mm between tiles with grout joints of 3mm or less .
 
OP
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Dumbo

Also should be a soft joint at the ceiling either caulk or silicone . Are the vertical corners grouted or siliconed .
 
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Waluigi

Back to brick then I’d hazard a guess that a board was dot and dabbed on? This is the perfect surface to get flat and Plumb so the tile should be absolutely spot on which this is far from.

Is there any reason the whole bathroom was finished before this poor tile was picked up on?

Shame it wasn’t noted sooner as it would’ve been easier to put a halt to the tile works so a professional could be brought in.
 
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130
Good heavens & i'm being polite, if that's what they pass off as acceptable & within BS their on crack get em back to rectify their mistakes if take em to court don't call their buff go in hard & dont take no for answer
 
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Tile Shop

According to the company owners who did the job the work is within industry standards ?!

No way is it. The lipping between tiles should be no more than 1mm. It looks like you have at least 2mm there in some places. Totally unacceptable. The standards they should be working to are BS5385 Part 1. Not some fictional standards they have plucked out of a magical unicorns bum:

"7.1.9.2 Across joints
There should be no appreciable difference in level across joints (commonly known as "lipping") and the maximum deviation between tile surfaces either side of the joint, including movement joints, should be as follows.
a) Joints less than 6 mm wide, 1 mm.
b) Joints 6 mm or more wide, 2mm."

You have to get them back and give them the opportunity to correct their work. If they refuse, well, we'll have to cross that bridge if/when it comes to it.
 
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if they refuse it's a no brainer,there are no bridges to cross Paul it all there in the pictures bang to right & the worsed part about they've prepared the walls apparently would hate to see the work if they hadn't touched them,legal action all the way
 

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