Failed Floor - Tile Advice

[radim]

went to change couple of broken tiles and this is outcome....

first floor, chipboard floor, 9 mm ply, wet UFH between joists, all tiles debonded from addy, addy to ply stuck well, job done 2 years ago. total of 55 m2.
Can you guys share your opinions what went wrong here?
cheers

 

[Ian]

Can't see the pics mate.

 

[JMC tiling]

Pictures not showing, what are the tiles made of? do you remember how the tiles were stored? possibility they could have been in wet/damp conditions and retained moisture? this may stop them bonding well to the addy?

 

[radim]

i will try to reload them pics...

 

[J Sid]

The tiles were ok for 2 years, yes ?

Sounds like a possibility of excess heat, seen something similar before after failure of flow temperature control in ufh, water temp went to 80 deg. Thermal shock. Customer started to deny it, a builder, but his sister let it slip one day.

 

[Chalker]

Problem here is you have wet ufh with chipboard and the plywood on top of that. Both products are insulators, so customer wants warm floor. But can't as the timber is basically lagging the ufh. So they turn up the manifod temperature to make the floor feel better and doing so, the floor gets hotter, to a point that the tiles de-bond from the ply.
You could blame th customer, but a timber floor on top of ufh is asking For trouble.

 

[Just Rizzle]

Problem here is you have wet ufh with chipboard and the plywood on top of that. Both products are insulators, so customer wants warm floor. But can't as the timber is basically lagging the ufh. So they turn up the manifod temperature to make the floor feel better and doing so, the floor gets hotter, to a point that the tiles de-bond from the ply.
You could blame th customer, but a timber gloom on top of ufh is asking God trouble.

totally agree with above to much insulating products bound to fail . bet there heating bill is a small fortune

 

[Tile seller]

Can't say I understand these floors either. Probably a more inert material than ply would have been better as a final layer beforr tiling. Could have gone straight down with hardie floor.

 

[JMC tiling]

But he's saying that the addy is still stuck to the floor but tiles have come away clean? So that makes no sense?

 

[Just Rizzle]

mmm

 

[Tile seller]

As ply shrinks and expans a flexible adhesive may well have stayed stuck to the wood and in good condition however,the forces this transfered to the tile perhaps could have debonded what was a weaker attachment.
Ply expands and can handle it, adhesive goes with it and can handle it also, the tile doesn't expand which creates the stress.
Or, maybe my imagination has gone funny lol

 

[J Sid]

You guy's not come across this ufh method before?
I would have uncouple on top of chipboard if floor solid, did a bathroom and a shower room yesterday, not plied, but have seen it done many times. HB would have insulated to much, no? If it was to fail I would have expected sooner the 2 years.
To me clearly a heat issue.

 

[radim]

 

[radim]

 

[radim]

Thank for your replies guys.
All tiles come up clean like new...
Builder is paying the bill but wants to know where is a problem.
I will be using hardie but if it is heat related than it can surely happen again?