Caution! Rapid Set adhesive vs BIII ceramic wall tiles - Tile Advice

[Tile Shop]

I currently have several ongoing customer issues that I am investigating where ceramic tiles are crazing within 1-2 weeks of installation. The constants in all cases are that a rapid-setting adhesive has been used and the tiles are BIII (Eb > 10%). I have sent the details and images to the Technical guys of the TTA to look into.

It's not temperature related (thermal expansion) as this has started to occur at different times of the year. We suspect that the rapid shrinkage and increase in tensile strength of rapid setting adhesive as it sets and cures are (in some cases) too strong for tiles with a lower density, modulus of rupture and breaking strength. This puts stress on the tile, causing random hairline cracks. The TTA is looking at each case and their chairman has agreed that further discussions on the subject will take place at their next technical committee meeting, so we will hopefully have an update soon.

Tile wise to name a few from past and present issues, I’ve had tiles from Lasselsberger, Ribasalbes, Porcelanosa, Fabresa, Salcamar, Recer, then the rapid set adhesives from Palace, Norcros, Tilemaster, Weber, BAL and Ultra. They can’t all be supplying faulty products that present identical issues, and its too much of a coincidence that the tiles have always been BIII (Eb > 10%) ceramics and the adhesive has always been rapid set.

I know many of you will never entertain using rapid-set on a wall, but for those that do, I would advise limiting it to use on porcelain tiles or flooring grade ceramics.

 

[hmtiling]

Get back on the green star chaps

 

[Boggs]

Oh, I put some BCT’s on with Bal Rapid 3 weeks back!

Awaits angry phone call.

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Used Butech rapid white on some sh*t Ukrainian tiles on Monday!
It’s can always be an issue with a bathroom co. that don’t give you the tile details before you go. Just take adhesive everything else is there.

 

[Tile Shop]

Not had a BCT tile affected in the same way...... yet
Usually, if it's advertised as ceramic and for wall use only, it's likely to be a BIII.

Fine with slow set or ready-mixed, but if you want to use rapid, I personally would double-check.

I'm not saying every job will be affected. Even within the BIII classification, strengths and densities can vary. I'm just pointing out that when combined with rapid setting adhesive, it seems to be a catalyst for potential issues. here's one example:


With this one, it happened all around the bathroom affecting well over 50% of the tiles. All fitted correctly, correct spacing, correct perimeters, correct tanking in the wet areas, primed everywhere else, trowelled not spot fixed. A handful of tiles started crazing in 4-5 days. In two weeks, it was a murder scene!

 

[Andy Allen]

Personally, I would never use rapid set with ceramic tiles for this very reason, to many crap ceramics on the market ATM...!

 

[On one]

Being a 'steady eddy' I wouldn't use rapid set on a whole bathroom but, where you need to finish the tiling in the morning,to grout in the afternoon or around window heads would always be a possibility.

 

[Tile Fix Direct]

In addition to Paul's comments, bed thickness is a factor and with the increase in size of ceramic tiles the bed thickness is likely to increase. With the increase in bed thickness we can expect an increase in shrinkage and potential crazing.
Other potential contributory factors is the desire for narrower joints and the widespread failure to provide sufficient provision for movement in wall tiling. Frequently tiles are virtually butted together in internal corners resulting in an insufficient gap to fill with silicone.
Background maturity is another factor that could possibly contribute to crazing.Timber framed houses probably being the worst example, there have been suggestions on tiling forums that timber framed houses should not be tiled for 6 months to allow for movement to finish. Tilers in this area are reporting that there are cases of timber stud work moving and causing 20mm humps & hollows which if even a fraction of this occurs after tiling, crazing could result.
In our experience high gloss tiles appear to be more prone to crazing (or is it you cannot see crazing on mat tiles?). The artisan style reactive gloss glazes appear most prone.

 

[Flintstone]

I haven't personally had this issue but I am aware of it, my supplier has mentioned it a few times not to use rapid on ceramics for this reason..